Feb. 18, 2022

RJ Mischo interview

RJ Mischo interview

RJ Mischo joins me on episode 56. RJ hails from the twin cities of Minneapolis-St Paul, where he developed his craft with a little help from local player Slim Lynwood. He then teamed up with Mojo Buford to perform around the cities, including recording an album with Mojo. With numerous albums out under his own name, RJ has also made a career out of performing gigs with ‘pick-up’ bands when he goes on tour, giving his live shows the freshness and spontaneity that he likes to bring out. One th...

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Season 1 Diatonic Harmonica Blues Harmonica

RJ Mischo joins me on episode 56.
RJ hails from the twin cities of Minneapolis-St Paul, where he developed his craft with a little help from local player Slim Lynwood. He then teamed up with Mojo Buford to perform around the cities, including recording an album with Mojo.
With numerous albums out under his own name, RJ has also made a career out of performing gigs with ‘pick-up’ bands when he goes on tour, giving his live shows the freshness and spontaneity that he likes to bring out.
One thing that really stands out is the plentiful fine harmonica instrumentals across his album releases.
RJ is back to work so look out for one his gigs and be sure to check out this great player.


Website:
http://rjblues.com/

Videos:

Song from Mojo Buford Harpslinger album:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKjF_gMSQSs

Song from Blues Deluxe album:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTJCosoKm3g

Song from I Hope You’re Satisfied album:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YASa-rg3Bdg

Playing harmonica on a rack using RackIt:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYK1KPydSDc

RJ teaching at Harmonica Collective:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ee-e3WfqEoM

Playing with Junior Watson in 2021:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-v7y-_NK-M


Podcast website:
https://www.harmonicahappyhour.com

Donations:
If you want to make a voluntary donation to help support the running costs of the podcast then please use this link (or visit the podcast website link above):
https://paypal.me/harmonicahappyhour?locale.x=en_GB

Spotify Playlist:
Also check out the Spotify Playlist, which contains most of the songs discussed in the podcast:
https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5QC6RF2VTfs4iPuasJBqwT?si=M-j3IkiISeefhR7ybm9qIQ

Podcast sponsors:
This podcast is sponsored by SEYDEL harmonicas - visit the oldest harmonica factory in the world at www.seydel1847.com  or on Facebook or Instagram at SEYDEL HARMONICAS
and Blows Me Away Productions: http://www.blowsmeaway.com/

Support the show

01:14 - RJ is based on the west coast of America, although originally from the twin cities of Minneapolis-St Paul

02:12 - Started playing at the young age of 10 and professionally by age 19

03:01 - Started playing harmonica when picked up his brother’s harmonica

03:52 - Johnny Winter with Walter Horton was some of the first blues RJ heard

04:50 - First started learning harmonica by playing along with records and difference of learning with vast resources available today

06:40 - Hearing a Muddy Waters concert really turned RJ onto the blues, with Jerry Portnoy and Mojo Buford on the bill

07:59 - Moved to the twin cities and met Lynwood Slim, where RJ made his first appearance with a blues band

09:15 - Had appeared with Country and Western songs prior to this

10:25 - RJ plays a lot of blues chromatic, which he initially heard from Lynwood Slim

11:46 - RJ’s association with Mojo Buford, including recording the album Harpslinger with him

13:39 - Where Mojo Buford got the stage name ‘Mojo’, and he was a harp player with Muddy Waters

14:43 - RJ’s Ready To Go album from 1992, and before that had some albums with Blues Deluxe

15:36 - Had some success with the Kid Morgan Blues band which led on to some touring in Europe for RJ with another band

17:58 - Has used ‘pick-up’ bands extensively when touring

19:18 - How RJ approaches playing with a pick-up band

20:48 - Picked up by a German label, releasing several albums through them

22:34 - Lot of instrumentals recorded by RJ

23:30 - He Came To Play album

25:16 - Always like to include a spontaneous recording on an album

26:18 - Moved to California in 1998 and blues scene on west coast of US

27:44 - Techniques he’s asked other players about

28:47 - Started playing with Rusty Zinn when first moved to California

29:40 - The advantage to being the singer as well as harmonica player

32:14 - Knowledge You Don’t Get In School album

32:59 - Make It Good album

33:23 - How RJ comes up with his harmonica instrumentals

35:54 - I Hope You’re Satisfied is RJ’s latest album

36:49 - Everything I Need is a self-produced album

36:54 - Working on a new album of mostly solo material

37:10 - Playing harmonica on a rack including using the RackIt by Greg Heumann

40:12 - RJ was shot at one time

41:06 - Played with Trickbag in Sweden and on Mark Hummel’s Blues Harmonica Meltdowns

42:15 - Recorded some parts for Dave Barrett’s Mel Bay harmonica tuition books

42:50 - Listed in the Encyclopaedia of the Harmonica

43:00 - Taught at several of Jon Gindick’s harmonica camps

43:42 - 10 minute question

44:17 - Tone

47:08 - Tongue blocking

47:54 - RJ is a Hohner endorsee

48:24 - Plays custom Marine Bands

50:12 - Favourite key of diatonic

50:33 - Different tunings

51:38 - Chromatics of choice

52:21 - Different positions

52:50 - Overblows

53:10 - Amps of choice

55:01 - Doesn’t use effects pedals and travelling light

55:36 - Small amps

56:02 - Mics

56:55 - Recording set-up

57:25 - What has RJ been doing over pandemic and future plans

WEBVTT

00:00:00.289 --> 00:00:02.512
RJ Mishaw joins me on episode 56.

00:00:03.593 --> 00:00:06.397
RJ hails from the twin cities of Minneapolis, St.

00:00:06.477 --> 00:00:11.243
Paul, where he developed his craft with a little help from local player Slim Linwood.

00:00:12.064 --> 00:00:18.132
He then teamed up with Mojo Buffett to perform around the cities, including recording an album with Mojo.

00:00:19.054 --> 00:00:32.331
With numerous albums out under his own name, RJ has also made a career out of performing gigs with pickup bands when he goes out on tour, giving his live shows the freshness and spontaneity that he likes to bring out.

00:00:33.212 --> 00:00:38.859
One thing that really stands out is the plentiful fine harmonica instrumentals across his album releases.

00:00:39.960 --> 00:00:51.134
RJ is now back to work so look out for one of his gigs and be sure to check out this great player.

00:00:53.634 --> 00:01:07.816
Hello R.J.

00:01:07.936 --> 00:01:09.319
Michaud and welcome to the podcast.

00:01:10.421 --> 00:01:11.942
Hey Neil, thank you for having me.

00:01:12.664 --> 00:01:14.106
Thanks so much for joining us today.

00:01:14.608 --> 00:01:18.593
And so you're based on the west coast of America at the moment, yeah?

00:01:18.634 --> 00:01:21.018
Yes sir, I'm in Ventura, California.

00:01:21.281 --> 00:01:23.884
And I know that's not where you originally started.

00:01:23.903 --> 00:01:26.606
You were up in Minneapolis from the Twin Cities.

00:01:26.986 --> 00:01:28.128
Minneapolis and St.

00:01:28.227 --> 00:01:28.789
Paul.

00:01:29.149 --> 00:01:32.131
What was the harmonica scene like up there and what got you into playing?

00:01:32.331 --> 00:01:34.433
Well, it was quite a rich scene.

00:01:34.593 --> 00:01:37.115
I started out just really young.

00:01:37.195 --> 00:01:44.561
I was playing harmonica from discovering some of my brother's harmonicas, but I didn't really have a direction with it.

00:01:44.762 --> 00:02:11.329
But like in junior high, when I first really moved to the Twin Cities from eastern Wisconsin, I was a around the neighborhood and I heard a guy playing the blues harmonica sound and then went on and through high school just you know met mutual buddies that were on the path to discovering and learning all about blues and then and then as I got into it as a career I found out there was quite a rich blues scene actually in the Twin Cities.

00:02:11.689 --> 00:02:14.432
Yeah so you so you started playing at age 10 you say?

00:02:14.712 --> 00:02:25.973
You know I'm not exactly sure that's kind of what my mom says but around that age it seems like I must have been And in fifth or sixth grade, I think I really started getting interested in harmonica.

00:02:26.112 --> 00:02:28.780
Yeah, so I was pretty young then to start playing age 10.

00:02:28.840 --> 00:02:30.906
So do you think that gave you those extra years?

00:02:30.985 --> 00:02:33.713
And I think you started playing professionally, what, about the age 19?

00:02:33.734 --> 00:02:36.681
Yeah, so you had a good few years under your belt by then.

00:02:37.090 --> 00:02:38.752
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

00:02:38.771 --> 00:02:47.263
I mean, I was, I put in a lot of hours when I was, oh, between maybe 15 and 20 years of age.

00:02:47.364 --> 00:02:49.866
I drove a lot of people insane with harmonica.

00:02:50.768 --> 00:02:53.451
Yeah, that seems to be the peak age when people really get into it.

00:02:53.472 --> 00:02:55.294
I think it's those later teenage years, isn't it?

00:02:55.313 --> 00:02:58.717
When you really get those obsessions that hopefully stick with you in later life.

00:02:59.318 --> 00:02:59.960
Absolutely,

00:03:00.000 --> 00:03:00.441
yeah.

00:03:00.980 --> 00:03:04.286
And so you got your first harmonica from your brother, is that right?

00:03:04.705 --> 00:03:12.318
Well, I was sneaking his harmonicas and then he had found it when he was out of the house.

00:03:12.419 --> 00:03:14.481
I remember seeing a couple of harmonicas.

00:03:14.562 --> 00:03:23.236
It was like one of those Lancer harmonicas and like maybe a Scout harmonica that he had.

00:03:23.296 --> 00:03:25.159
So they're kind of like budget model harps.

00:03:25.540 --> 00:03:38.643
And then he found out that I was playing them and actually brought me to a little music store in the little town we were in, in eastern Wisconsin, and bought me a marine band, I believe, was my first harmonic of my own.

00:03:39.521 --> 00:03:39.962
That's great.

00:03:39.983 --> 00:03:42.165
So your brother didn't beat you up for stealing his harmonicas.

00:03:42.186 --> 00:03:43.007
That's a good story.

00:03:43.507 --> 00:03:45.289
Yeah, very supportive.

00:03:46.831 --> 00:03:49.816
Did you start playing in the sort of high school bands at school?

00:03:50.376 --> 00:04:01.390
Yeah, like by ninth grade, a good friend of mine in art class turned me on to the music of Johnny Winter, you know, who was a guitar player, of course.

00:04:01.731 --> 00:04:08.741
But on one of those early records at that time, Big Walter Horton was playing on it and Willie Dixon.

00:04:09.633 --> 00:04:14.484
And

00:04:21.158 --> 00:04:22.401
at about that time...

00:04:23.009 --> 00:04:49.673
ninth grade really started you know finding you know the the black american blues and really started on the course of um investigating and then and then found the little walters and all the harmonica players through like you know muddy waters so that was that was just before that time when johnny uh helped do those blue sky records you know the iconic hard again record of muddy waters

00:04:50.134 --> 00:04:54.658
when you started picking it up yourself how were you learning were you just listening to records and playing along

00:04:55.218 --> 00:05:18.192
um yeah absolutely i was just i remember having maybe one or two harmonicas and had no idea about keys or anything um i i don't even know if i if it even registered what those letters on the harmonica or i would just just literally try to play along with records and i had no idea i wasn't even in the right key

00:05:19.425 --> 00:05:22.788
Yeah, I mean, I'm fascinated by this way that people used to learn.

00:05:22.809 --> 00:05:24.430
I mean, I was the same when I started playing.

00:05:24.449 --> 00:05:25.411
That's how I learned.

00:05:25.471 --> 00:05:35.839
But more recently, what, in the last 15, 20 years with the internet, everyone looks at YouTube and there's lots of online tuition and, you know, I know you do some tuition yourself in camp, so we'll get onto that later.

00:05:35.879 --> 00:05:41.665
But, you know, what do you think the differences are between how you learned back then and, you know, all the endless resources we've got now?

00:05:42.065 --> 00:05:43.586
Well, yeah, exactly.

00:05:43.646 --> 00:05:56.879
Like you said, we were, like, very secretive of it I mean, you know, people that could play, some that weren't divulging the information readily.

00:05:56.920 --> 00:06:00.423
You know, there wasn't, there was the Tony Glover book out.

00:06:01.125 --> 00:06:04.408
And I mean, I was never, you know, learned anything through books.

00:06:04.728 --> 00:06:06.490
But yeah, it was a big difference.

00:06:06.670 --> 00:06:19.343
I mean, because literally, I would take the needle on the record and put it on the first few grooves or first few licks, take it off and try to emulate whoever it was or whatever the lick was.

00:06:19.343 --> 00:06:36.524
was and nowadays yeah like you say there's just so many sources and there's and the results is there's so many incredible players now I mean it was a very rare thing playing harmonica when I started out.

00:06:36.845 --> 00:06:39.451
There just wasn't many guys doing it, at least where I was.

00:06:40.012 --> 00:06:45.947
So I believe that what really turned you on to blues as well was seeing Muddy Waters in concert.

00:06:46.387 --> 00:06:47.069
Absolutely.

00:06:47.089 --> 00:07:03.257
I saw Muddy when I was like I remember I wasn't old enough to get in the place, so I wasn't of the drinking age yet, and the drinking age at that time was only 18, so I must have been 17, yeah.

00:07:03.357 --> 00:07:05.237
Big influence on me, absolutely.

00:07:05.358 --> 00:07:07.339
Do you remember which harmonica player you had with him?

00:07:07.560 --> 00:07:19.730
It was Jerry Portnoy playing harmonica with Muddy, and then Mojo Buford, who was living in the Twin Cities, and later I became very close with, but I didn't know at that time, was opening the show.

00:07:19.850 --> 00:07:24.016
So it was a double dose of electric blues harmonica players.

00:07:24.538 --> 00:07:29.065
There's a song on one of your albums called Meet Me on the Coast where you talk about this first time.

00:07:45.473 --> 00:07:49.315
Well,

00:07:49.375 --> 00:07:51.709
clearly you were inspired by the concert to write that song, yeah?

00:07:52.257 --> 00:07:58.442
Yeah, I mean, Muddy Waters would be probably my biggest influence all the way around,

00:07:58.783 --> 00:07:59.043
sure.

00:07:59.744 --> 00:08:02.466
So you'd moved to Minneapolis and St.

00:08:02.526 --> 00:08:03.627
Paul at this stage, had you?

00:08:03.927 --> 00:08:04.649
Yeah, yeah.

00:08:04.829 --> 00:08:18.079
We came from a small town in eastern Wisconsin, and my dad got work in the Twin Cities, and I think it was around fifth, sixth grade, it was when I moved to the Twin Cities.

00:08:18.100 --> 00:08:21.283
And it's here you became friends with Linwood Slim?

00:08:21.583 --> 00:08:37.460
Right about this same time that i would have seen muddy belray ballroom was right around the year i graduated from high school 77 78 and i met linwood slim in a club yep he immediately kind of took me under his wing and we had a long association

00:08:37.841 --> 00:08:39.722
so he was playing in the band then already

00:08:39.962 --> 00:08:53.437
he was playing in a bar i had a fake um id because i remember i still wasn't of drinking age but you know everyone looked like a kid you know the drinking age was 18 so you know the they weren't that strict.

00:08:53.717 --> 00:09:06.390
I remember going to a place called the Clover Club, and Lin Wooden was playing, and he took a break, and I introduced myself, and I had my pockets full of harmonicas, and he said, hey, partner, I'm going to call you up.

00:09:06.530 --> 00:09:07.793
Get up on the bandstand.

00:09:07.832 --> 00:09:15.581
So that could be one of the first times I ever played with a real blues band, I would say, that night.

00:09:15.821 --> 00:09:18.264
I had sat in with bands in bars.

00:09:18.703 --> 00:09:39.807
Previous to that, I would go over to Wisconsin on the river and those places were real easy to get in and I would sit in with country western bands all the time there was tons of traditional country western bands playing small bars but Linwood Slim's band would be the first time I really played with an electric blues band in a club

00:09:40.027 --> 00:09:45.052
So with a country western were you trying to play that style or were you just playing generally bluesy stuff with them?

00:09:45.552 --> 00:09:55.403
I was playing bluesy stuff with them because there was a couple of those bands that I would actually visit on a regular basis and play the same songs.

00:09:55.464 --> 00:09:59.648
And I remember they would usually do maybe like a Jimmy Reed type of song.

00:10:00.149 --> 00:10:01.669
So they would cater to me more.

00:10:01.730 --> 00:10:06.174
They would do a nice 12 bar and give me something that I could really stretch out on, which was nice.

00:10:06.615 --> 00:10:09.739
And were you playing Jimmy Reed style harmonica then or whatever you knew?

00:10:10.219 --> 00:10:12.140
No, I had no idea what the hell I was doing.

00:10:12.522 --> 00:10:13.403
I'm sure I wasn't.

00:10:13.562 --> 00:10:17.647
I might have heard of first position and different positions at that point.

00:10:17.767 --> 00:10:20.590
But no, I was probably really annoying everybody.

00:10:20.691 --> 00:10:22.493
But I think I must have played good And so

00:10:25.900 --> 00:10:28.846
Linwood Slim, as you say, he took you under his wing to some extent.

00:10:29.008 --> 00:10:35.261
So he plays quite a bit of blues chromatic, doesn't he?

00:10:44.833 --> 00:10:46.235
Yeah, that's right.

00:10:46.436 --> 00:10:51.644
I had never seen anybody used to sing and play five long years.

00:10:51.745 --> 00:10:54.708
Have you ever been mistreated on a chromatic?

00:10:54.729 --> 00:11:00.236
And that was always very impressive to me because I, yeah, I'd never seen anybody playing blues chromatic before.

00:11:00.477 --> 00:11:03.602
So you play a lot of blues chromatic yourself as well as a lot of diatonic.

00:11:03.623 --> 00:11:08.590
So is that, did you start playing blues chromatic from an early age, you know, from the assistants from Limwood?

00:11:08.850 --> 00:11:09.491
I guess so.

00:11:09.731 --> 00:11:10.833
Yeah, you could say that.

00:11:11.330 --> 00:11:19.197
I mean, it's still not, I still have a lot to learn, but, um, yeah, I guess I would have got a chromatic.

00:11:19.256 --> 00:11:32.989
I think I remember starting with one of those 10 hole chrome monicas and, um, and then at one point graduating, getting your first big two 80 and, uh, yeah, Linwood would have definitely been a big influence on chromatic for me.

00:11:33.048 --> 00:11:33.288
Sure.

00:11:33.469 --> 00:11:33.688
Yeah.

00:11:33.769 --> 00:11:36.611
So you, you appreciated that different sound that the chromatic gave.

00:11:36.772 --> 00:11:40.254
Is that what you, you know, what you liked about it just to give you that different feel than the diatonic?

00:11:40.654 --> 00:11:45.621
Um, I've, probably, and just the impressiveness of the size and everything, you know.

00:11:45.981 --> 00:11:46.182
Great.

00:11:46.202 --> 00:12:06.730
And then as we mentioned Mojo Bifford earlier on, he was also in the Twin Cities, got to hang out with him and got to know things from him.

00:12:07.138 --> 00:12:14.543
Yeah, I would have become quite associated and hanging out with George a lot from maybe 1980.

00:12:14.563 --> 00:12:19.668
You know, through my early 20s, we did a double harmonica thing.

00:12:20.229 --> 00:12:29.937
I was booking shows and we would play together and I would open the shows and usually stay on the bandstand through George's set as well.

00:12:30.118 --> 00:12:43.811
Maybe go down for a few songs, but he would keep me up there with him and we would do a two harmonica thing and we played many shows all around the Twin Cities area and some road trips but mostly local gigs.

00:12:44.091 --> 00:12:44.851
Yeah, fantastic.

00:12:44.871 --> 00:12:46.374
Did you ever do any recording with him?

00:12:47.014 --> 00:12:47.875
Yeah, sure did.

00:12:48.817 --> 00:13:18.427
There is some recordings on Blue Moon and then they had to change the name for legal purposes because there's another label to Blue Loon Records and those are pretty rare collectible records but there's a Mojo Buford CD called and there's some single records on 45 called Harp Slinger, where I and another harmonica player from the Twin Cities by the name of Curtis Blake and Mojo.

00:13:18.447 --> 00:13:33.501
So this record has three harmonicas on it.

00:13:39.905 --> 00:13:45.711
So Mojo Buffett, he got the nickname Mojo, I believe, from playing Got My Mojo Working with Muddy Waters.

00:13:46.010 --> 00:13:48.092
Yeah, there was a club that he played.

00:13:48.133 --> 00:13:51.796
He had a house gig, and it was before my time, before I was getting into clubs.

00:13:52.096 --> 00:14:05.467
But I guess he had a club that he played as a house band, and people requested that song so much that he just kind of, in the early 60s, started calling himself Mojo, using that as his moniker.

00:14:05.807 --> 00:14:09.871
Yeah, and he was Muddy Waters' harmonica player on and off for quite a few years, wasn't he?

00:14:09.871 --> 00:14:12.615
Many years, yeah, off and on.

00:14:12.774 --> 00:14:18.620
And Mojo, in my opinion, was a brilliant accompanist.

00:14:18.802 --> 00:14:25.408
I mean, he really knew how to play a subtle, beautiful backing blues harmonica.

00:14:25.629 --> 00:14:27.250
Did you get to meet Muddy Waters yourself?

00:14:27.890 --> 00:14:29.052
No, not personally.

00:14:29.072 --> 00:14:36.399
I mean, I saw Muddy, I want to say, three times, I can remember for sure, live and in concert.

00:14:36.620 --> 00:14:39.703
And I saw him with Mojo playing as well, but...

00:14:39.823 --> 00:14:43.431
No, I never went up and got introduced or anything.

00:14:43.772 --> 00:14:45.916
I know you got your first album out.

00:14:46.096 --> 00:14:49.081
I've got it down in 1992, the Ready To Go album.

00:14:49.121 --> 00:14:51.385
Now, this is with the Kid Morgan Blues Band.

00:15:01.645 --> 00:15:01.725
Yeah.

00:15:04.865 --> 00:15:07.311
And there was some previous stuff I did before that.

00:15:07.650 --> 00:15:15.746
I had a band called Blues Deluxe in the Twin Cities, and there was a few releases at that time, cassette tapes.

00:15:34.625 --> 00:15:35.830
Okay, yeah, so you're with this blues...

00:15:35.850 --> 00:15:37.674
Look, so to this R.J.

00:15:37.755 --> 00:15:42.910
Michaud and the Kid Morgan blues band, that was your second blues band, and this is still in the Twin Cities, yeah?

00:15:43.413 --> 00:15:47.365
It is, and we had a house gig, Kid Morgan...

00:15:47.778 --> 00:15:54.264
And the other members of that band, everybody had a different band, their main band.

00:15:54.323 --> 00:16:00.428
So this was actually a spinoff band where we played a club every Sunday night called the Five Corners Saloon.

00:16:00.469 --> 00:16:02.129
We started getting attention.

00:16:02.169 --> 00:16:03.230
That was quite a night.

00:16:03.270 --> 00:16:07.554
That was really turned into a big night, Sundays at the Five Corners.

00:16:07.735 --> 00:16:11.599
And we started getting offers to play with that band.

00:16:11.778 --> 00:16:13.780
So we took it on the road a little bit.

00:16:14.181 --> 00:16:29.856
Then Kid had gotten an offer for James Harmon and he moved out here and then the band just kind of disbanded and Percy and everybody had really a different project going so that was just a very short-lived band actually

00:16:30.057 --> 00:16:32.539
Did you tour Europe with this band or was that later on?

00:16:32.799 --> 00:16:32.960
You

00:16:33.019 --> 00:16:49.817
know my first introduction to Europe was through that record I was contacted by the Mulan Blues Festival in Holland in 1993 and they wanted that band and And that band was not a possibility.

00:16:49.857 --> 00:16:54.403
You know, Kid was already out here with Harmon and everyone was on their own project.

00:16:54.823 --> 00:17:02.491
So I just kind of talked them into hiring me and the band that I had to represent that record as good as possible.

00:17:02.951 --> 00:17:06.855
I was so disappointed because it was my first offer to play in a different country.

00:17:07.076 --> 00:17:10.559
I remember his name is Bart Billmacher, very nice guy.

00:17:10.619 --> 00:17:11.682
And I've seen Bart since.

00:17:11.761 --> 00:17:14.904
And he said, well, you know, we're sorry.

00:17:14.944 --> 00:17:17.188
We really wanted to, you know, get that band.

00:17:17.228 --> 00:17:29.079
So they acted you know like they weren't interested and I was so disappointed like two months later they called back and they said the committee decided we'll give you guys a chance so I represented that record without that band actually

00:17:29.099 --> 00:17:32.923
yeah great and did you just play in Holland that time or anywhere else in Europe that time

00:17:32.963 --> 00:17:57.570
was just Holland the first time was just that festival and then a couple of club dates and then I got picked up by an agent in Holland and I did another tour with the kid the first time I came over was not with the kid and then I did another tour with Kid Morgan and we played a lot of dates I remember that mostly Holland and Belgium maybe some in Northern France or something like that

00:17:58.131 --> 00:18:08.942
Something you've done over the years is it a bit more recently you played with a pickup band which basically means you've toured by yourself and then just played with a band that's available on the locations is that it?

00:18:09.202 --> 00:18:14.308
Yeah it's kind of my preference actually pardon me I've been doing it for years now

00:18:14.749 --> 00:18:15.009
Yeah

00:18:15.390 --> 00:18:16.391
when did you start doing that?

00:18:16.651 --> 00:18:25.766
I started doing at, you know, it was economical, you know, was the first reason, of course, would be for economics.

00:18:26.047 --> 00:18:30.934
And it was in Germany, I started playing with B.B.

00:18:30.974 --> 00:18:32.076
and the Blue Shacks.

00:18:32.577 --> 00:18:39.589
So that would have been the first time that I started touring with an ensemble that wasn't a band that I put together.

00:18:39.970 --> 00:18:41.613
And that worked out real well.

00:18:42.114 --> 00:18:51.662
I started getting offers in different parts of Europe, like up in Scandinavia, and where a band would basically invite me over to play with them.

00:18:52.022 --> 00:18:57.086
And I found out that it worked, and there's a real good chemistry in that.

00:18:57.748 --> 00:19:02.070
I really prefer it at this point in my life, and it just makes it so much easier.

00:19:02.471 --> 00:19:04.393
Yeah, I mean, logistically, a lot easier, right?

00:19:04.432 --> 00:19:05.815
Just having to travel yourself.

00:19:05.875 --> 00:19:09.778
So at this point then, they were obviously hiring Audrey Michaud, the name, right?

00:19:09.837 --> 00:19:11.779
And yourself, rather than the band.

00:19:12.039 --> 00:19:14.762
Is that how you know that they found out about you and you got the gigs

00:19:15.022 --> 00:19:16.284
I guess so

00:19:18.247 --> 00:19:21.911
so how do you approach them playing with a band that you've never played with before

00:19:22.191 --> 00:19:43.113
what I'll typically do is maybe just send a few tunes a few tunes in advance you know I mean I'll vet I mean if someone contacts me that I never heard of before I mean I'm gonna have to hear how they play and sound and everything a little bit before I agree to it you know usually if they're contacting me contacting me.

00:19:43.252 --> 00:19:47.998
They're obviously blues players and are into that kind of music.

00:19:48.057 --> 00:20:02.854
So typically, I'll advance a few songs for the band to learn and then just keep it real loose and what I call it shooting from the hip, you know, like a Western gunslinger without a real straight aim and just keep it real spontaneous.

00:20:02.993 --> 00:20:07.659
And that's what I like when I see a blues performance.

00:20:07.759 --> 00:20:16.728
I like to see a guy out there kind of on the edge where they're not just just yawning and looking at their watch because they can play this automatically.

00:20:16.768 --> 00:20:17.588
You know what I mean?

00:20:18.048 --> 00:20:18.349
Yeah.

00:20:18.509 --> 00:20:24.454
So I've read something about what you like about it is the fact that, you know, like if you're of the band who's been touring for three years, right?

00:20:24.535 --> 00:20:30.500
You played the song, you know, a thousand times together, but you like that spontaneity of having to sort of create the moment.

00:20:31.000 --> 00:20:35.584
I think both have advantages and disadvantages, just like anything.

00:20:35.625 --> 00:20:43.776
But for my particular, what I really, what I really enjoy is, has got a sloppy aspect to it.

00:20:43.816 --> 00:20:45.778
I like loose blues.

00:20:45.837 --> 00:20:46.979
I don't like it real tight.

00:20:48.240 --> 00:20:48.460
Yeah.

00:20:48.780 --> 00:20:51.663
I guess on the back of this, you got picked up by a German label again.

00:20:51.703 --> 00:20:54.405
I think you released five of your albums through a German label.

00:20:54.465 --> 00:20:54.946
Is that right?

00:20:55.086 --> 00:20:56.147
Yeah.

00:20:56.307 --> 00:20:59.530
Crosscut Records and my good friend Detlev Hogan up there.

00:20:59.651 --> 00:20:59.852
Yeah.

00:21:00.152 --> 00:21:03.055
And was the first one of those the Rough and Tough album?

00:21:03.335 --> 00:21:03.935
Yeah.

00:21:04.175 --> 00:21:10.461
And then Cool Disposition followed and...

00:21:11.137 --> 00:21:29.480
Buff and tough.

00:21:30.300 --> 00:21:34.066
I remember when he showed me that album cover and he came up with that title.

00:21:34.306 --> 00:21:36.468
I was like, well, I don't know.

00:21:37.589 --> 00:21:39.352
He was referring to the music, not me.

00:21:41.250 --> 00:21:53.598
Yeah, rough and tough and then cool disposition and then West Wind Blowing, which was first released on a small label up in San Mateo, California.

00:21:53.638 --> 00:21:55.102
Yeah.

00:22:11.617 --> 00:22:14.268
and meet me on the coast, and he came to play.

00:22:14.288 --> 00:22:14.789
Is that it?

00:22:14.871 --> 00:22:18.605
Oh, and then there's a live one from Lutcern, too, that down-home trio.

00:22:19.009 --> 00:22:46.109
you know you're a real full-on blues just you know really grooving bump and grind shuffles uh real real electric chicago in your face you know some great strong harmonica playing that too you know if people haven't checked you out before it's that you know you get some great stuff out there and a lot of a lot of really great instrumentals as well which i always like as a harmonica fan of course cool me too uh quite a few again on chromatic old night cat so

00:22:47.778 --> 00:22:55.948
Goat

00:22:58.250 --> 00:22:59.712
Whiskers is an interesting one.

00:22:59.732 --> 00:23:01.615
That's played on an F-harp, isn't it?

00:23:01.634 --> 00:23:03.938
You don't get too many instrumentals played on an F-harp.

00:23:04.419 --> 00:23:10.205
Yeah, I think I totally lifted that from a Sonny Boy Williamson stomp off of something like Trumpet.

00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:00.000
...

00:23:25.122 --> 00:23:30.330
I'm trying to play like a Rice Miller trumpet label type of stuff on that.

00:23:30.671 --> 00:23:34.999
Yeah, so again, the first album I heard you was on He Came to Play.

00:23:35.019 --> 00:23:39.005
You're sort of like an alien on the cover on this one, aren't you?

00:23:39.846 --> 00:23:42.050
Another great instrumental on this one is The Pole.

00:23:51.006 --> 00:23:51.165
The Pole

00:23:56.738 --> 00:24:04.163
and that funny one about RJ come and get it which is a short you do quite a few short sort of instrumentals and that's an illustration of one of those isn't it

00:24:04.404 --> 00:24:34.071
I can tell you the story on that I'll make it short on RJ come and get it we were totally no plan literally we were packing up and the guy that was funding the session and had the label he stuck his head in the studio and he's like come on there's a little bit more tape here give us you know and the drummer was already we were all Just one take as well?

00:24:34.531 --> 00:24:41.298
Yeah, absolutely, yeah.

00:25:06.498 --> 00:25:07.134
Bye.

00:25:12.097 --> 00:25:13.818
They're often the best, aren't they?

00:25:13.839 --> 00:25:15.500
Those little short ones.

00:25:16.020 --> 00:25:24.269
I always love to save time for just, yeah, just throwing stuff out there and just real spontaneous.

00:25:24.588 --> 00:25:30.594
Just going, here we go, or whatever, without telling anybody anything and see what you get.

00:25:30.953 --> 00:25:37.480
And so, again, a bit like the pickup band, you know, are you instructing the band about the structure of the song when you're doing that?

00:25:37.500 --> 00:25:40.182
Are you just literally starting to play and, you know, they're picking up on it?

00:25:40.442 --> 00:25:40.702
Both.

00:25:41.143 --> 00:26:12.777
A lot of guys you know you can just you don't have to say anything you don't even have to tell the key you just go out there and kind of play harmonic a little bit and then they start playing along and then they find the key and I won't even say nothing I'll just go and the band is in so yeah and I'll just do intros and if you just have intros or a good pickup line I'll just set it up for the band.

00:26:12.836 --> 00:26:17.000
I'll just make it up as I kind of go along a lot of times.

00:26:18.143 --> 00:26:23.909
During these album releases we've talked through, you moved to California I think in 1998.

00:26:24.429 --> 00:26:27.553
What prompted you to move out to San Francisco, was it?

00:26:28.634 --> 00:26:29.535
For love, man.

00:26:29.615 --> 00:26:34.900
My girl came out here and then I came out a while afterwards.

00:26:35.881 --> 00:26:37.482
She got a job out here.

00:26:37.502 --> 00:26:39.244
I was living in the Twin Cities.

00:26:39.885 --> 00:26:45.090
She was out here a bit and asked me if i wanted to come out join her and i says sure

00:26:45.451 --> 00:26:55.041
and so out there of course is a fantastic harmonica scene and then we got some some amazing players kim wills from rob piazza many more what is it you think about that west coast scene for the harmonica

00:26:55.261 --> 00:27:25.314
well yeah all those guys i was i was influenced big time of course by rod kim hummel bill clark and uh of course all those guys were big disciples of george harmonica smith and there's there's a lot more guys than that I mean that's just those are the big names at the top of the list but there's so many great harmonica players out here now yeah what can I say I'm in good competition which I love

00:27:25.734 --> 00:27:32.602
so did you start you know hanging out with any of these guys or you know start picking things up from them or were you all just quite separate

00:27:32.761 --> 00:27:45.618
only through record and that would be with anybody even back to the days of my early days with Linwood Slim I never really sat down with anybody and had any kind of instruction.

00:27:45.959 --> 00:27:49.865
I mean, other than Linwood made me aware of tongue blocking.

00:27:50.267 --> 00:27:53.973
And, you know, and that was it, just making me aware of this.

00:27:54.434 --> 00:28:01.867
But other than that, just from listening to records, but no, I never went up to anybody and tried to pick their mind.

00:28:01.907 --> 00:28:12.223
The only thing is in recent years, I asked Kim one time about this like real rapid fire lick that he can do.

00:28:12.284 --> 00:28:13.904
And he does it.

00:28:14.185 --> 00:28:15.386
Junior Wells does it.

00:28:15.446 --> 00:28:18.809
I think I used to do it before I learned how to tongue block.

00:28:19.130 --> 00:28:20.070
It's a draw thing.

00:28:20.151 --> 00:28:24.855
It's a diddly diddly diddly thing on the draw that I can't get.

00:28:24.974 --> 00:28:27.116
And I remember Kim saying it's not a tongue block thing.

00:28:27.156 --> 00:28:28.538
And I said, I knew it wasn't.

00:28:28.897 --> 00:28:34.983
And then I remember asking like Magic Dick about how he plays those high note first position blows.

00:28:35.344 --> 00:28:40.769
And kind of, you know, getting some real precise verbal direction from those guys on that.

00:28:40.869 --> 00:28:46.695
But other than that, through my whole life, I never really sat down and asked anybody how to do something.

00:28:47.196 --> 00:28:53.242
And so when you went out to California, did you then set up a new band or were you still basically playing kind of pickup bands?

00:28:53.502 --> 00:28:57.287
I was in with Rusty's Inn as soon as I came to town.

00:28:57.688 --> 00:29:10.020
My first gig was with Rusty's Inn, Richard Innes, Larry Taylor and the piano player Steve Lucky opening up for unbelievable jazz singer Jimmy Scott.

00:29:10.521 --> 00:29:12.443
And that was my first gig.

00:29:13.265 --> 00:29:21.073
The week I got into the Bay Area, I was in that band playing at the Stern Grove Park to thousands of people.

00:29:21.192 --> 00:29:27.819
So I spent quite a bit of time in the Rusty Zinn band playing all around Bay Area.

00:29:27.859 --> 00:29:33.226
And then Rusty kind of changed the format and I went off and started doing gigs with other players.

00:29:33.806 --> 00:29:35.248
And were you the singer in that band?

00:29:35.248 --> 00:29:37.509
No, no, I was a harmonica player.

00:29:37.769 --> 00:29:39.211
So you have done the Sideman thing.

00:29:39.471 --> 00:29:39.612
Yeah.

00:29:39.852 --> 00:29:41.413
Mostly you've been the main singer, yeah?

00:29:41.614 --> 00:29:42.355
Yeah, of course.

00:29:45.798 --> 00:29:47.159
Hello, baby.

00:29:47.179 --> 00:30:02.334
I saw your last name.

00:30:04.417 --> 00:30:08.053
What about the singing, the vocals, and putting that together with the harmonica?

00:30:08.413 --> 00:30:10.603
How critical is that to be the band leader?

00:30:10.844 --> 00:30:14.136
Well, it's kind of everything, I think, at this point.

00:30:14.561 --> 00:30:19.526
And yeah, singing has been a very, very difficult journey.

00:30:19.586 --> 00:30:21.228
It never came natural for me.

00:30:21.347 --> 00:30:28.134
But I realized that that's the role you have to take if you actually want to try to be a working professional harmonica player.

00:30:28.413 --> 00:30:32.156
You're a pretty lucky guy if you got a job as a harmonica player.

00:30:32.217 --> 00:30:36.560
You don't have to be the one calling the shots and getting the gigs and singing the songs.

00:30:37.582 --> 00:30:41.125
You say that's a decision you took quite early on, is it to think, right, I've got to be the singer.

00:30:41.144 --> 00:30:43.567
And then did you sort of force yourself to sing?

00:30:43.586 --> 00:30:46.891
You didn't really feel like you naturally we're great at singing exactly

00:30:47.230 --> 00:30:56.961
it was hard and embarrassing for many many years you know you just kind of learn what to use what you got instead of trying to sound like somebody else and all of that

00:30:57.182 --> 00:31:20.105
but I mean it's funny because quite a lot of players on here say exactly that thing that you said which is they don't think they're very good singers but they sort of you know they force themselves to do it where I think you know most of you guys including you you know do have a good voice you know so but it's something you really feel you had to work at and you know to get better and like you say it took you several years yeah so you'd recommend people persevere right absolutely absolutely I mean

00:31:20.727 --> 00:31:47.335
you know the journey is so long so you don't remember a lot of the struggles in the early times but I mean musical struggles and now some of the keys that I like couldn't sing at all in when I was younger now have turned into some of my favorite keys to sing it it's like anything it's it's just hours you will get better at it but it takes a long time and

00:31:47.375 --> 00:32:06.955
again it's something you've just learned yourself right you never had singing lessons or anything no just finishing off on your album so you had three more albums which got maybe some more recognition you sort of got in the in the top 50 in the living blues albums on the knowledge you can't get in college and make it good in 2009 2012 were they more commercially successful than the others or

00:32:07.537 --> 00:32:28.659
well I mean commercially successful I mean might be a few hundred more copies sold one in the other but Knowledge You Can't Get in College did get quite a bit of airplay on XM Radio over here, which is a subscription radio.

00:32:28.798 --> 00:32:31.883
So I did get a good, some royalties off of that, yeah.

00:32:32.042 --> 00:32:34.204
And that's all kind of school-based, isn't it?

00:32:34.224 --> 00:32:35.946
You've got the song Too Cool for School.

00:32:35.967 --> 00:32:52.607
¶¶ I'm

00:32:52.728 --> 00:32:54.471
switching harps on that.

00:32:55.011 --> 00:32:59.438
I'm playing a low and a high F sharp.

00:32:59.919 --> 00:33:00.219
Cool.

00:33:00.380 --> 00:33:04.445
And then Make It Good, all the songs on that album are all originals, yeah?

00:33:04.486 --> 00:33:06.107
So these songs that you wrote yourself?

00:33:06.248 --> 00:33:06.828
Yeah.

00:33:07.210 --> 00:33:07.670
Yeah, great.

00:33:07.750 --> 00:33:10.173
And The Frozen Pickle, another great instrumental.

00:33:12.718 --> 00:33:12.798
Yeah.

00:33:13.569 --> 00:33:21.693
so

00:33:23.394 --> 00:33:24.934
How do you come up with an instrumental

00:33:25.395 --> 00:33:26.135
on the harp?

00:33:26.537 --> 00:33:34.282
You know, what I'll do is I just dig through my record collections when it's time to make a record.

00:33:34.323 --> 00:33:37.766
I'm an avid music listener, first of all.

00:33:37.826 --> 00:33:41.430
I listen to music pretty much constantly.

00:33:41.470 --> 00:33:52.880
And I'll just listen to music, and then when I get in the mindset, like, well, I guess it's time to start trying to figure out material for a record, I just kind of listen with open ears.

00:33:53.359 --> 00:34:05.833
And if something catches me and it might be, oh, just a rhythm part that one of the instruments might be doing on some song where there's, you know, five, six, seven instruments on there.

00:34:05.893 --> 00:34:09.818
But it might be just some little part that the piano is doing or something.

00:34:10.097 --> 00:34:12.519
And then I'll tune in or the drum beat even.

00:34:12.740 --> 00:34:16.764
And I'll kind of tune in on that instrument in the song.

00:34:17.184 --> 00:34:23.311
And I'll just kind of imagine if that line is kind of the dominant rhythm.

00:34:23.311 --> 00:34:29.934
You know, so because sometimes songs, someone's playing a counter rhythm with inside the melody.

00:34:30.476 --> 00:34:33.969
So I, you know, I just steal little bits and kind of alter them a little bit.

00:34:34.273 --> 00:34:38.039
And it's mostly spontaneous, Neil.

00:34:38.119 --> 00:34:52.057
Those instrumentals are just grabbing guys, getting the best guys I can for sessions and just kind of giving them a vague idea of the feel and then just let the tape roll, cut it a few times and take the best one.

00:34:52.278 --> 00:34:53.981
So, yeah, there's some really good songs in that album.

00:34:54.001 --> 00:34:56.224
That Papa Saint special is a good one.

00:34:56.563 --> 00:34:58.666
It's a Sonny Terry style playing from you.

00:35:00.610 --> 00:35:00.670
And...

00:35:13.474 --> 00:35:15.878
Arambula is an interesting one.

00:35:15.898 --> 00:35:16.679
What's that one about?

00:35:16.998 --> 00:35:22.246
Well, that's just a made up word because I love gibberish words.

00:35:22.487 --> 00:35:36.929
And that's pretty much, that groove is pretty much lifted right out of the Albert Collins playbook, man.

00:35:36.949 --> 00:35:36.989
So

00:35:47.905 --> 00:35:52.094
And then I think it's your last album, Everything I Need, from 2014.

00:35:53.077 --> 00:35:54.480
Actually, it's not.

00:35:54.900 --> 00:35:59.269
I put out a record since then called I Hope You're Satisfied.

00:35:59.289 --> 00:36:26.222
I Hope You're Satisfied It's on Bluebeat Records, which if I can send out a plug to somebody would be Bluebeat Music, who is a great record maker and distributor up in the Bay Area.

00:36:26.262 --> 00:36:34.748
But I have a compilation of unreleased material from the last five or six CDs.

00:36:34.849 --> 00:36:37.271
So I have a new CD I'll call it.

00:36:37.371 --> 00:36:38.813
I hope you're satisfied.

00:36:39.012 --> 00:36:42.195
And I think there's 13, 14 takes on there.

00:36:42.255 --> 00:36:44.702
but they are all previously recorded.

00:36:44.898 --> 00:36:48.501
recorded unreleased songs from other sessions actually

00:36:49.302 --> 00:36:54.405
so that the everything i need album in 2014 was a self-produced album from you yeah correct

00:36:54.646 --> 00:37:07.097
and and i am working i have a a whole new album of material written of originals and um i was intending i already cut it solo because i'm doing guitar and harp rack

00:37:07.617 --> 00:37:17.947
yeah i was going to ask you about the guitar and heart right so there's a there's a nice clip i saw of you playing the the racket by greg human and i I had Greg Heumann on the podcast a while ago and I talked about the racket.

00:37:18.007 --> 00:37:20.909
So playing guitar and horn and moniker and a rack now, yeah?

00:37:21.750 --> 00:37:22.490
I'm trying.

00:37:22.530 --> 00:37:25.853
Is that a recent thing for you?

00:37:26.134 --> 00:37:26.934
Yeah, it is.

00:37:27.215 --> 00:37:38.164
I mean, I certainly have been messing around with it for some years, but as far as actually going out and playing a gig like that, that's pretty new.

00:37:38.644 --> 00:37:41.766
Yeah.

00:37:44.750 --> 00:37:44.829
Yeah.

00:37:46.626 --> 00:38:05.655
Yeah, I think one of the challenges with playing harmonic on the rack is, of course, that you don't sound as good on the harmonic as you do when you play, you know, without any other instruments, right?

00:38:05.715 --> 00:38:08.059
Naturally, because you're doing more than one thing at once, right?

00:38:08.139 --> 00:38:14.356
So is that something that you know, you're conscious of and you're thinking, yeah, maybe I'll just play the harmonica by itself.

00:38:14.396 --> 00:38:15.740
But, you know, you want to get it up to scratch.

00:38:15.760 --> 00:38:17.706
You think it's worthwhile getting it up to scratch as well?

00:38:18.568 --> 00:38:19.492
Well, I do.

00:38:19.913 --> 00:38:24.606
And I want to say something about playing, for me anyway, is...

00:38:24.833 --> 00:38:32.425
When I'm playing guitar and rack harmonica, I play completely different harmonica.

00:38:33.266 --> 00:38:42.097
I play in a way that I wouldn't actually be able to do if I was just holding the harmonica by itself and playing the harp alone.

00:38:43.079 --> 00:38:59.695
What I'm finding is like doing a first position thing is I kind of like I sure like to do these kind of like you know rag type of like Sonny Boy One does that You know, I must have had a wonderful time last night.

00:38:59.835 --> 00:39:01.257
At least they tell me I did.

00:39:01.597 --> 00:39:04.380
One of those kind of rag type of things.

00:39:05.121 --> 00:39:17.251
But when I play that with a first position and I'm playing guitar, I can really get around on the harp, whereas I wouldn't be able to play first position like that if I wasn't playing guitar.

00:39:17.751 --> 00:39:18.932
So it's kind of weird.

00:39:18.992 --> 00:39:23.396
I mean, it's like, wow, I'm really playing first position when I'm playing guitar.

00:39:23.456 --> 00:39:50.889
But if I just go to play in first position when I'm not playing guitar, it's back to that more you know chicago-y little walter first position with jimmy reed in there or whatever but but i i can really seem to fly first position when i'm playing it when i'm accompanying myself on guitar it's pretty cool and i sing so much more relaxed when i'm playing guitar that resonance of the guitar seems to like help keep your voice and pitch and stuff

00:39:51.329 --> 00:39:54.634
so you're intending to what to release an album with you playing solo

00:39:55.233 --> 00:39:56.295
I am.

00:39:56.315 --> 00:40:00.942
That's my intentions, but I don't think the whole thing will be solo.

00:40:01.181 --> 00:40:11.757
I think it's going to be mostly me playing guitar and rack harp, and then a few of them will have some kind of skeleton accompaniment, I think.

00:40:12.137 --> 00:40:12.777
Is it right?

00:40:12.838 --> 00:40:15.501
I heard you talking about you were shot at once at

00:40:18.505 --> 00:40:18.606
a gig.

00:40:18.626 --> 00:40:19.708
I can't believe I'm laughing.

00:40:19.728 --> 00:40:23.373
I guess I am laughing because it did happen.

00:40:23.432 --> 00:40:24.253
Yeah.

00:40:24.418 --> 00:40:25.699
Same night I met my wife.

00:40:25.739 --> 00:40:27.161
It wasn't her, was it?

00:40:28.222 --> 00:40:30.005
Good one, good one.

00:40:30.045 --> 00:40:32.028
No, it wasn't.

00:40:32.289 --> 00:40:44.326
It was, yeah, on the way to a gig at that Five Corners Saloon and I was just about to go in the door and I got held up by a guy and, well...

00:40:44.737 --> 00:41:04.807
Make a long story short, I live, so I'm here to tell about it today, but I fled, and the guy shot at me a couple of times and didn't hit me, and I made it up on a bandstand, and then I looked down there, and I've seen some twinkling eyes, and the rest is history.

00:41:06.594 --> 00:41:13.547
So you've also played with various other bands, yeah, as a sideman a lot of the time, you know, on other albums.

00:41:13.646 --> 00:41:15.751
So you play with Trickbag.

00:41:15.811 --> 00:41:17.614
Is that Trickbag in Scandinavia?

00:41:17.914 --> 00:41:18.817
Yeah, yeah.

00:41:18.836 --> 00:41:19.938
It's Tommy and those guys.

00:41:20.360 --> 00:41:23.385
Yeah.

00:41:23.405 --> 00:41:23.485
Yeah.

00:41:32.385 --> 00:41:36.289
And you've also played on these Blues Harmonica Meltdown albums.

00:41:36.869 --> 00:41:39.331
Oh, you mean on Mark Hummel's Blues Harmonica?

00:41:39.351 --> 00:41:39.932
Yeah, yeah.

00:41:40.952 --> 00:41:42.514
So how did they come about?

00:41:42.715 --> 00:41:46.978
Is it like a gig you all go and play together, or is an album recorded separately?

00:41:47.599 --> 00:41:55.186
No, those are those from the famous Mark Hummel Blues Harmonica blowouts that he tours once a year.

00:41:55.465 --> 00:42:00.751
So those are both ones that were just recorded actually live at one of the blowouts.

00:42:02.351 --> 00:42:10.525
Yeah!

00:42:15.617 --> 00:42:19.360
You've also played, I think, on Dave Barrett's Mel Bay books.

00:42:19.882 --> 00:42:32.032
I'm in a couple of Mel Bay books, but yeah, I know David has me sampling, I think like a turnaround sample on an instructional CD that comes in one of the books.

00:42:32.572 --> 00:42:36.715
And I remember he sent it to me and I think it's a beginner harmonica book.

00:42:36.996 --> 00:42:43.902
And I remember I was laughing because I think the title was, it doesn't get any easier than this.

00:42:44.302 --> 00:42:48.449
And I looked at it and I was like, oh my god i have no idea what the heck they're talking about

00:42:50.369 --> 00:42:52.472
Are you listed in the encyclopedia of the harmonica?

00:42:52.831 --> 00:42:56.675
I'm honored, but I don't know how that came about even.

00:42:57.076 --> 00:42:58.117
I didn't solicit it.

00:42:58.376 --> 00:42:59.438
You just got in there, great.

00:42:59.458 --> 00:43:00.117
Well, you deserve it.

00:43:00.398 --> 00:43:01.278
You do do some teaching.

00:43:01.539 --> 00:43:07.905
You teach, I think, sort of harmonica camps, and you've taught at John Gindick's harmonica camps quite a few years, haven't you?

00:43:08.164 --> 00:43:08.925
Yeah, I did.

00:43:09.065 --> 00:43:12.349
I'm retired from doing the camps anymore.

00:43:12.789 --> 00:43:17.452
Yeah, I have a lot of instruction experience in my own way.

00:43:17.474 --> 00:43:41.599
I mean, I'm totally non theoretical so you know i don't ever talk about scales or or notes or anything it's all about just feel playing and that kind of thing teaching is a whole nother thing i mean i that that i've gotten better at it i have to give it up for the guys that are really good harmonica instructors because it's a very difficult instrument to instruct

00:43:42.119 --> 00:43:48.065
a question i ask each time rj is if you had 10 minutes to practice what would you spend those 10 minutes doing

00:43:48.445 --> 00:44:17.237
tone you know getting a good sound and for me again it's all about the song and the music more so than the instrument yeah tone and feel you know the listener and that's what moves me the most too is playing space instead of just concentrating on the notes you can play you can also concentrate on the notes to leave out too

00:44:17.737 --> 00:44:23.603
you know just a little bit more on tone then so what would you do to try and work on your tone on harmonica?

00:44:23.804 --> 00:44:30.210
Just to make sure that you are not fooling yourself with sound.

00:44:30.951 --> 00:44:42.304
The tongue-blocking thing, if you're a beginner and you're not tongue-blocking, that would definitely be the thing you would want to really spend some time on so you've got that, so that snaps in.

00:44:42.824 --> 00:44:45.387
What's unique about the harmonica with tone?

00:44:45.427 --> 00:44:50.192
I think a lot of us harmonica players see tone as the Holy Grail of playing the harmonica.

00:44:50.192 --> 00:44:56.478
compared to maybe like other instruments like guitar where i don't know if it's tone so important on on guitars it is on harmonica

00:44:56.639 --> 00:45:44.862
well i think a tone on a harmonica is probably much more difficult to achieve than it is on you know a guitar hitting a string or you know or plunking a note on a piano i mean obviously or you know hitting a drum skin but obviously those instruments you have to be able to get a good tone as well but with the harmonica you know you're using your body and you know your chest cavity and your lung capacity to help form that tone in your throat and your mouth there's so many body working parts compared to just your fingers so

00:45:52.929 --> 00:46:28.318
¶¶ Thank you.

00:46:51.137 --> 00:46:57.865
Yeah, so to really make sure you're getting a good, deep, full tone instead of that nasally...

00:46:57.905 --> 00:47:00.550
Like I said, instead of that...

00:47:01.190 --> 00:47:01.630
You want the...

00:47:04.014 --> 00:47:06.737
That low tone, that open sound.

00:47:08.119 --> 00:47:12.585
You mentioned, obviously, tongue blocking being an important part of that sound, getting that bigger cavity.

00:47:12.625 --> 00:47:13.485
So are you...

00:47:13.985 --> 00:47:15.789
more full-on tongue-blocking?

00:47:15.829 --> 00:47:16.992
Did he do much puckering at all?

00:47:17.432 --> 00:47:20.059
For me, the tongue-blocking is the thing.

00:47:20.099 --> 00:47:26.733
But that being said, I've heard guys that don't tongue-block that can get a big, big, deep sound.

00:47:27.137 --> 00:47:30.903
whatever it means it takes to get that sound.

00:47:31.105 --> 00:47:42.603
But a lot of people, it seems on harmonica, they can go for a long time kind of maybe fooling themselves or really not hearing that they're not getting that tone.

00:47:42.965 --> 00:47:50.197
I guess record yourself, compare yourself to the people you like and see if you can try to emulate getting a deeper tone.

00:47:51.010 --> 00:47:53.956
So we'll move on now to the last section to talk about gear.

00:47:54.038 --> 00:47:56.684
So I believe you're a Hohner endorser.

00:47:57.065 --> 00:47:57.266
Yep.

00:47:58.047 --> 00:47:59.150
So how did that come about?

00:47:59.570 --> 00:48:03.541
I got the endorsement years and years ago just by sending them...

00:48:04.226 --> 00:48:07.128
I mean, it was in the late 80s or something like that.

00:48:07.349 --> 00:48:08.809
It was all done by mail then.

00:48:09.170 --> 00:48:14.315
Yeah, I just contacted them and I became a owner in Dorsey and I've just kept up with it ever since.

00:48:14.735 --> 00:48:17.177
And I still play, you know, Marine Band harmonicas.

00:48:17.237 --> 00:48:19.759
That's my instrument of choice.

00:48:20.260 --> 00:48:20.480
Yeah.

00:48:20.559 --> 00:48:23.643
Any particular flavors of the Marine Bands you like nowadays?

00:48:23.943 --> 00:48:25.724
Well, I mean, I get most of my stuff.

00:48:25.864 --> 00:48:32.851
I mean, you know, I'm playing Felisco harps and Spires harps, Richard Slay harps, and I get some from Deke.

00:48:32.971 --> 00:48:42.621
So I'm mostly playing my customized marine bands and uh yeah just the the stock marine band and the new ones new ones are good

00:48:42.840 --> 00:49:03.443
the custom ones are they provided via hone or are you getting those directly from from joe flisco and the other guys you mentioned there directly from the customizers sure i mean i've never played a joe flisco monica obviously lots of people have talked about on about them on here and they're like this amazing i mean you know what is it about those really well customized harps you think you obviously think it's worth it paying for them yeah

00:49:03.643 --> 00:49:13.293
well for First of all, you know, you're going to buy one harmonica and when you do flatten out a reed, you can send it back for repair.

00:49:13.554 --> 00:49:21.262
So in the long run, you know, the initial cost of the first one is going to be quite a bit more than just a regular harmonica.

00:49:21.362 --> 00:49:25.786
But in the long run, it's actually cheaper if you're playing all the time.

00:49:26.588 --> 00:49:45.568
I completely changed my playing when I started playing custom harmonicas because You know, like Joe says, that's a very common thing is I was wiping out the harps because they are so much easier to play.

00:49:45.608 --> 00:49:47.891
You can play much softer.

00:49:48.251 --> 00:49:54.378
And it was a learning, a little bit of a learning curve, holding back and realizing that you didn't have to play so hard.

00:49:54.637 --> 00:50:07.030
So it's actually helped my playing, being able to play these instruments because I play much more controlled and much lighter and not not with as much velocity to get the same results.

00:50:07.391 --> 00:50:10.235
And do you ever try customizing harmonicas yourself?

00:50:10.514 --> 00:50:12.036
No, no, I'm not into it.

00:50:12.396 --> 00:50:14.559
What about a favorite key of diatonic?

00:50:14.659 --> 00:50:18.623
I think you read somewhere that you like to carry an A harmonica with you at all times.

00:50:19.023 --> 00:50:20.025
Is this still the case?

00:50:20.364 --> 00:50:27.954
I think that's pretty much the standard harp that all guys stick in their pocket, an A or a C harp when they're going to go out on town.

00:50:28.293 --> 00:50:29.014
How about you, Neil?

00:50:30.056 --> 00:50:31.797
Yeah, it's got to be the A, hasn't it?

00:50:33.318 --> 00:50:38.905
What about any different tunings do you ever use any of those on the diatonic well um lately i've been doing

00:50:38.945 --> 00:51:34.485
this two chord thing with a uh a minor harp i had ordered some harps from honer and this is a few years ago and they mistook and i picked one up and i was like what the heck is this and then i looked at it and it was a uh a d minor and i remember years ago having those they were called orchestra harps or something like that and i'm thinking wow this isn't what i want and then all of a sudden I played it so it was too late to like send it back so I just started messing around with it and so I do this kind of two chord first position minor gypsy east you know baltic sounding type of groove that's pretty fun that's about it though with the different tunings I have a cowboy tuned one haven't really used it too much I do hey good looking with it but I haven't done it on gigs yet as an instrumental

00:51:34.965 --> 00:51:43.336
is that with the the raised five draw yeah and what about chromatics which chromatics do you like to play and then 12 holes 16 holes as well

00:51:43.557 --> 00:51:45.000
typically you know i carry

00:51:45.039 --> 00:51:46.141
the you know the big

00:51:46.280 --> 00:51:49.005
one

00:51:50.027 --> 00:51:56.014
chromonica playing the 16 holes are you playing a lot of octaves with that sure you know i mean i will

00:51:56.034 --> 00:51:58.931
do a george smith type of Chords, yeah.

00:51:59.210 --> 00:52:05.278
Both, I go between that and playing more single hole, you know, Little Walter style, just third position.

00:52:17.273 --> 00:52:23.902
And on the diatonic, do you play many chords?

00:52:24.034 --> 00:52:24.715
different positions?

00:52:24.795 --> 00:52:30.278
I mean, she talks about playing some third position, third position, third position, and obviously second position.

00:52:30.500 --> 00:52:31.820
Do you venture much beyond those?

00:52:32.260 --> 00:52:32.742
I don't.

00:52:32.981 --> 00:52:39.547
I'm going to try now that I'm doing more rack stuff, but I haven't really as of yet.

00:52:39.788 --> 00:52:42.130
Mostly, you know, mostly cross harp.

00:52:42.769 --> 00:52:44.170
I do like first position.

00:52:44.190 --> 00:52:50.197
I think I play third position pretty well, but I don't use it much to tell you the truth.

00:52:50.556 --> 00:52:51.797
And what about any

00:52:51.818 --> 00:52:52.418
overblows?

00:52:53.378 --> 00:52:53.579
Nope.

00:52:53.719 --> 00:53:09.516
I've tried tried to do them i've caught them by mistake but i mean i think you have to have your uh you do want your your your your harmonica gapped your reed gap i think for that as well yeah i'm not interested in them actually no at this at this point anyways

00:53:09.976 --> 00:53:13.380
so what about equipment wise what what sort of amplifiers you like to use

00:53:13.780 --> 00:53:25.375
backline if they're you know good a good you know reissue basement if there is there's one there uh good just any good fender tube amp i've got a collection of uh several Yeah, yeah.

00:53:26.998 --> 00:53:30.507
So have you had

00:53:33.012 --> 00:53:36.179
these amps modified for harmonica or you just play them from stock?

00:53:36.960 --> 00:53:38.103
Mm, play them from stock.

00:53:38.143 --> 00:53:39.967
And actually I prefer them from stock.

00:53:40.047 --> 00:53:40.728
I'm not...

00:53:41.090 --> 00:53:47.478
a fan usually of harmonica voiced amplifiers, to tell you the truth.

00:53:48.079 --> 00:53:49.081
I want them to be clean.

00:53:50.181 --> 00:53:59.795
If I'm playing through an amp, I almost want it to have like a, imagine like a tube PA, like you're playing through a Shure Vocal Master from 1968.

00:53:59.894 --> 00:54:04.320
So it's warm, but still clear.

00:54:05.061 --> 00:54:10.909
That overdriven sound has its place, but I like it to sound like a harmonica too.

00:54:11.137 --> 00:54:16.351
Yeah, so I noticed on some YouTube videos of you, you are playing through a PA quite a lot then.

00:54:16.492 --> 00:54:28.382
Is that...

00:54:35.233 --> 00:54:37.757
you go for that clean sound then more these days or

00:54:38.079 --> 00:55:00.157
well and that would be by um necessity or just from traveling and playing with pickup bands and not being able to bring well your amplifier with you so you have to be able to play through anything that's really important i think that's

00:55:01.090 --> 00:55:09.001
So you don't take any of these pedals when you're traveling, you know, this kind of distortion, you know, kind of driven pedals you can get for harmonica.

00:55:09.021 --> 00:55:09.161
No,

00:55:09.661 --> 00:55:10.021
no, no.

00:55:10.081 --> 00:55:13.045
I try to, I mean, I got to travel as stealthily as possible.

00:55:13.126 --> 00:55:19.695
That's the biggest concern when you do travel is how to get as condensed as you possibly can.

00:55:20.956 --> 00:55:35.744
So I think it's real good for a guy to be forced into that situation because you learn a lot about, How do you be effective without your crutch, you know?

00:55:36.103 --> 00:55:36.324
Yeah.

00:55:36.644 --> 00:55:37.925
What about any small amplifiers?

00:55:38.425 --> 00:55:43.030
You said that maybe if you're playing a bit more locally, is a small amplifier something you might use?

00:55:43.369 --> 00:55:57.302
Yeah, depending on the drummer, you know, but that Gibson GA-20 with a 12-inch, that 15-watt size amp, that's what I like to record with, is a Gibson GA-20.

00:55:57.342 --> 00:55:58.864
I've got a couple of those.

00:55:59.204 --> 00:56:01.045
That's kind of instant little Walter.

00:56:02.646 --> 00:56:05.449
Microphone-wise, are you you do carry a microphone with you on your travel?

00:56:05.809 --> 00:56:14.920
Yeah, typically I'll bring a, you know, an ecstatic mic or for a while I was carrying Greg's.

00:56:15.181 --> 00:56:24.693
I do find that that Shure element does seem to be more adaptable with a variety of amps.

00:56:25.172 --> 00:56:28.938
But typically my go-to mic is an ecstatic JT30.

00:56:29.250 --> 00:56:29.670
yeah so a

00:56:29.730 --> 00:56:30.110
crystal

00:56:30.490 --> 00:56:30.630
yeah

00:56:31.052 --> 00:56:34.954
and uh yeah i think i did see you playing through one of greg human's uh wooden mics yeah

00:56:35.155 --> 00:56:40.039
yeah i have a really nice one it's got a real good black label uh sure element in there

00:56:40.519 --> 00:56:44.884
oh they're beautiful aren't they they're so beautiful did you did you choose the design yourself

00:56:45.063 --> 00:56:49.688
no that was greg greg has been very very good to me so yeah

00:56:50.047 --> 00:56:51.588
have you got your initials in the grill

00:56:51.789 --> 00:56:55.233
yep yep i didn't ask for it it just came that way yeah

00:56:56.012 --> 00:57:01.699
yeah and what about when you're recording any particular setup when you're you mentioned the amp anything else when you're recording

00:57:02.159 --> 00:57:20.318
no not really because I just use like a studio where I where I know the engineer is is on the same page as I am so they can help me with direction as far as mic placement and all that kind of thing so

00:57:20.699 --> 00:57:30.809
great and so yeah final question then RJ thanks so much for the time today so what have you been doing over the pandemic and you know now you're coming out of it it sounds like you're getting out playing already?

00:57:30.929 --> 00:57:32.371
Has things picked up for you nicely?

00:57:32.572 --> 00:57:36.275
Yeah, the calendar is starting to come back, thank God.

00:57:36.556 --> 00:57:51.672
And I had a double whammy back to back and I'm letting you in on this and your listeners as I had throat cancer and then just as I was recovering from that, the pandemic hit.

00:57:51.831 --> 00:57:57.237
So my calendar got wiped out and then wiped out but now it's all coming back again.

00:57:57.898 --> 00:58:00.581
Great, so you're all recovered now and still able to sing with that are you?

00:58:00.842 --> 00:58:02.063
Yeah man actually

00:58:02.123 --> 00:58:04.505
my voice is better in a strange way.

00:58:06.347 --> 00:58:07.268
They've improved it yeah.

00:58:07.588 --> 00:58:11.994
Are you just playing locally at the moment or are you looking to travel abroad at any point?

00:58:12.253 --> 00:58:29.952
Well I have a date with the Blues Heaven Festival in Denmark next November and some Finnish dates so but I have a lot of dates I just got back in from a festival I played with Junior Watson in the middle of the country into Des Moines, Iowa.

00:58:30.293 --> 00:58:45.009
We have a big show I'm going to plug that I'm helping put together with Rod Piazza and Dennis Gruenling and Tex Nakamura that was with War for a long time and John Gendick who lives here in Ventura.

00:58:45.108 --> 00:58:51.115
May 15th we're doing Ventura Harmonica Festival here in Ventura, California.

00:58:51.536 --> 00:58:54.318
Thanks so much for joining me today and great to talk to you.

00:58:54.639 --> 00:58:56.501
Hey Neil, thank you so much, man.

00:58:56.521 --> 00:58:57.481
That's episode 56.

00:58:57.882 --> 00:59:00.666
Thanks so much for listening and thanks so much for RJ Michaud.

00:59:01.005 --> 00:59:09.195
A big thanks to Adrian McLoone, Matthias Ernest, and a special big thanks to Philip Withers for helping for the donations, which help with the running cost of the podcast.

00:59:09.516 --> 00:59:13.440
Remember everyone to check out the harmonicaappyhour.com website.

00:59:13.800 --> 00:59:17.364
And it's over to RJ to play us out with the In-N-Out Boogie.

00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:00.000
...

00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:00.000
...

00:59:34.338 --> 00:59:44.030
Thank you.