April 17, 2020

Billy Branch interview

Billy Branch interview
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Season 1 Diatonic Harmonica Blues Harmonica Chromatic Blues

Billy Branch is a Chicago blues harp player who grew up learning directly from some of the classic generation of Chicago players,  such as Carey Bell, James Cotton and Junior Wells.
And he played in Willie Dixons band for 6 years.

Billy has been nominated for three Grammy awards.
He has become a real ambassador of the blues and takes great pride in maintaining that legacy with his long term band, the Sons of the Blues.

A great technical exponent of the harmonica, with great soul, Billy released his latest album Roots and Branches in 2019.

Select the Chapter Markers tab above to select different sections of the podcast (website version only).

Some of the YouTube clips mentioned:
Turkish politicians:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8z8zxRESLU

'I am the Blues' concert with Willie Dixon:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwL_wohIEMw

Mellow Down Easy video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajrB-sC_MsI

If you would like an online lesson with Billy, you can contact him here:
billybranchmusic@gmail.com


Podcast website:
https://www.harmonicahappyhour.com

Donations:
If you want to make a voluntary donation to help support the running costs of the podcast then please use this link (or visit the podcast website link above):
https://paypal.me/harmonicahappyhour?locale.x=en_GB

Spotify Playlist:
Also check out the Spotify Playlist, which contains most of the songs discussed in the podcast:
https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5QC6RF2VTfs4iPuasJBqwT?si=M-j3IkiISeefhR7ybm9qIQ

Podcast sponsors:
This podcast is sponsored by SEYDEL harmonicas - visit the oldest harmonica factory in the world at www.seydel1847.com  or on Facebook or Instagram at SEYDEL HARMONICAS
and Blows Me Away Productions: http://www.blowsmeaway.com/

Support the show

02:03 - Early Chicago days

04:07 - What got started playing harp

05:33 - First harmonica played

06:58 - Education and career choice

07:55 - Turkish Parliament

09:57 - Playing with Willie Dixon All Stars

11:42 - Sons of Blues band

13:52 - Grammy nominations

17:33 - WC Handy Awards

18:33 - Played at Giles Robson's old school

19:33 - Sons of the Blues reintroduced the blues

24:04 - Harp Attack album

30:41 - Roots and Branches album

35:21 - Harmonica influences

38:45 - Giles Robson brought Billy over to UK

40:01 - Advice for upcoming bands

41:58 - Billy's playing style

45:29 - Front man for band

47:28 - Blues Chromatic

49:17 - 10 minutes question

50:36 - Teaching

51:56 - Harmonica of choice

52:29 - Favourite key of harmonica

53:03 - Different tunings

54:03 - Amplifiers

55:29 - Microphones

57:16 - Effects pedals

57:45 - Future shows planned

WEBVTT

00:00:00.353 --> 00:00:09.153
Hi, Neil Warren here again and welcome to another episode of the Happy Hour Harmonica podcast with more interviews with some of the finest harmonica players around today.

00:00:09.955 --> 00:00:17.272
Be sure to subscribe to the podcast and also check out the Spotify playlist where some of the tracks discussed during the interviews can be heard.

00:00:19.905 --> 00:00:45.865
Billy Branch is a Chicago blues harp player who grew up learning directly from some of the classic generation of Chicago players such as Carrie Bell, James Cotton and Junior Wells and he played in Willie Dixon's band for six years.

00:00:46.530 --> 00:00:49.154
Billy has been nominated for three Grammy Awards.

00:00:49.314 --> 00:00:56.707
He has become a real ambassador of the blues and takes great pride in maintaining that legacy with his long-term band, the Sons of the Blues.

00:00:57.188 --> 00:01:05.141
A great technical exponent of the harmonica with great soul, Billy released his latest album, Roots and Branches, in 2019.

00:01:35.298 --> 00:01:37.742
Hello, Billy Branch, and welcome to the podcast.

00:01:38.141 --> 00:01:38.963
Yeah, hi, Neil.

00:01:39.043 --> 00:01:39.463
Thank you.

00:01:40.245 --> 00:01:41.507
It's a real pleasure to have you on.

00:01:41.566 --> 00:01:46.555
You're the first American I've had on this podcast, so it's great to get that.

00:01:46.775 --> 00:01:47.316
All right.

00:01:47.335 --> 00:01:49.099
Oh, well, I'm honored.

00:01:51.262 --> 00:01:54.227
We can start with a bit about yourself.

00:01:54.686 --> 00:01:56.650
So you currently live in Chicago.

00:01:56.689 --> 00:02:04.141
So when you were young, I understand you moved to Los Angeles for a little while and then back to Chicago to go to university.

00:02:04.322 --> 00:02:04.382
Yes.

00:02:04.737 --> 00:02:05.478
That's correct.

00:02:06.000 --> 00:02:09.444
So you went back to Chicago around the age of 18?

00:02:09.664 --> 00:02:11.788
Yeah, about 17.

00:02:12.629 --> 00:02:16.375
And so Chicago's a real mecca for the blues, yeah?

00:02:16.435 --> 00:02:20.360
So I assume that when you were 17, that's what it was like.

00:02:20.420 --> 00:02:22.304
It was still a real blues town then.

00:02:22.705 --> 00:02:23.926
Yeah, it still is.

00:02:25.068 --> 00:02:31.298
But during those times, you had so many great artists that you could see.

00:02:31.746 --> 00:02:34.149
practically free on a nightly basis.

00:02:35.250 --> 00:02:39.094
I mean, literally hundreds were alive and active at that time.

00:02:39.616 --> 00:02:41.758
Yeah, this was around Maxwell Street, wasn't it?

00:02:41.777 --> 00:02:42.919
Is that the main place?

00:02:43.461 --> 00:02:44.241
Well, no.

00:02:45.263 --> 00:02:50.308
Maxwell Street was a Sunday morning showcase.

00:02:51.030 --> 00:02:56.015
The majority of the blues artists did not perform on Maxwell Street.

00:02:56.256 --> 00:03:13.971
Maxwell Street was historically where some of the first migrants from the South where they had a showcase, including Muddy Waters, Little Walter, and Robert Nighthawk, a lot of the guys.

00:03:14.550 --> 00:03:28.593
And Maxwell Street was the open flea market, also known as Jewtown because Jewish merchants owned the surrounding shops.

00:03:29.377 --> 00:03:35.926
And then there was the flea market, you know, where you could, they say you could find anything on Maxwell Street.

00:03:36.026 --> 00:03:46.240
And then, I don't know how it was initiated, but, you know, the guy, different groups of musicians would set up on the street.

00:03:46.259 --> 00:03:52.068
They'd run an extension cord through somebody's window and they'd perform on the street for tips.

00:03:52.788 --> 00:03:54.730
And it was still around when I was here.

00:03:54.811 --> 00:04:06.062
I did go to Maxwell Street Sadly, not as much as I could have and should have, but I did go there quite a few times back when I was in college.

00:04:06.723 --> 00:04:09.044
What got you started playing the harmonica?

00:04:09.866 --> 00:04:11.526
Oh, just fate, destiny.

00:04:11.627 --> 00:04:25.160
I walked into a five and dime store and saw one, and a little voice told me I could play it, and I bought it and put it in my mouth, and I was immediately playing folk tunes and Christmas carols.

00:04:25.860 --> 00:04:27.221
Do you know what sort of age you were then?

00:04:27.617 --> 00:04:32.886
Oh, I was probably about, oh, maybe nine or ten, somewhere around there.

00:04:32.925 --> 00:04:33.867
And so

00:04:33.968 --> 00:04:37.894
you hadn't particularly heard any harmonica music before you bought it, or did you?

00:04:37.934 --> 00:04:39.295
No, I had not.

00:04:39.776 --> 00:04:42.401
Right, so you literally just picked it up and fancied playing it.

00:04:43.161 --> 00:04:43.663
Yeah.

00:04:44.163 --> 00:04:45.064
Yeah.

00:04:45.084 --> 00:04:47.507
Did you buy harmonica in L.A.

00:04:47.608 --> 00:04:48.370
or in Chicago?

00:04:48.410 --> 00:04:50.973
No, that was in L.A., that's...

00:04:51.233 --> 00:04:55.197
I didn't come back to Chicago until I was 17.

00:04:55.798 --> 00:05:01.624
So when you did start playing harmonic, did you start listening to harmonic music then or did that come a few years later?

00:05:02.144 --> 00:05:05.708
No, that didn't come until I got back to Chicago.

00:05:06.348 --> 00:05:18.779
I wasn't aware of any harmonic music per se, other than if I'd hear maybe a little pop riff on a pop song or rock song or something.

00:05:18.879 --> 00:05:20.060
But no, I didn't.

00:05:20.422 --> 00:05:20.742
I was...

00:05:21.346 --> 00:05:27.593
This was just something to entertain myself and in turn entertain my friends and family.

00:05:27.694 --> 00:05:29.516
I'd always keep it.

00:05:29.675 --> 00:05:32.459
When that one would wear out, I'd go back and buy another one.

00:05:33.079 --> 00:05:34.742
Do you know what type of harmonica that was?

00:05:35.884 --> 00:05:38.706
Yeah, it was called a Valencia harmonica.

00:05:39.528 --> 00:05:41.850
It was a double reed, folk style.

00:05:41.930 --> 00:05:42.732
It was curved.

00:05:43.713 --> 00:05:47.156
I even made it a point fairly recently to...

00:05:47.937 --> 00:05:49.119
to verify that.

00:05:49.158 --> 00:05:51.422
So I looked it up on the internet and there it was.

00:05:52.403 --> 00:05:53.043
So what we would

00:05:53.083 --> 00:05:54.444
call a tremolo harmonica?

00:05:55.586 --> 00:05:55.786
Yes.

00:05:56.226 --> 00:05:58.108
Okay, so yeah, a real folky harmonica.

00:05:58.548 --> 00:05:59.108
Interesting.

00:05:59.370 --> 00:06:02.112
So did you carry on playing that until the age of 17?

00:06:02.533 --> 00:06:03.413
I kept playing it.

00:06:04.154 --> 00:06:07.637
And do you know when you first bought your first diatonic harmonica?

00:06:08.358 --> 00:06:11.262
I was probably about 18.

00:06:11.822 --> 00:06:22.336
You know, at that time, in addition to All the blues that was surrounding, I mean, that was inundating Chicago.

00:06:22.497 --> 00:06:27.865
You know, on college campus, you know, there's always would-be musicians.

00:06:27.985 --> 00:06:31.511
So, you know, you'd run into different guys on campus.

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And I can't remember how or who turned me on to the Marine Band.

00:06:39.663 --> 00:06:41.545
I don't really remember that.

00:06:41.826 --> 00:06:43.249
But it

00:06:43.309 --> 00:06:43.629
wasn't

00:06:43.689 --> 00:06:44.029
long.

00:06:45.122 --> 00:06:47.944
So it was a marine band you got once you got your first diatonic.

00:06:47.964 --> 00:06:48.947
It was probably a marine band.

00:06:49.788 --> 00:06:50.288
Yeah.

00:06:51.269 --> 00:06:56.355
And so you really started picking up on the blue stuff when you went to college.

00:06:56.855 --> 00:06:57.216
Yes.

00:06:58.317 --> 00:07:01.221
And I understand you've got a degree in political science.

00:07:01.963 --> 00:07:02.223
That's

00:07:02.302 --> 00:07:02.562
right.

00:07:02.603 --> 00:07:05.526
And you were thinking about becoming a lawyer at one point.

00:07:06.228 --> 00:07:08.149
That was an option.

00:07:09.312 --> 00:07:11.014
I don't know how serious...

00:07:11.353 --> 00:07:14.418
I mean, by all accounts, I would have been a...

00:07:15.298 --> 00:07:46.079
successful one but you know when you're young you go to college and you know I pretty much it was pretty much understood that I would you know there was no question three generations of my family attended University of Illinois including my grandfather and who was a chemist and so here I was at University of Illinois but I didn't really know what I what I wanted to do.

00:07:46.158 --> 00:07:48.161
I thought, maybe I want to be a lawyer.

00:07:49.062 --> 00:07:52.648
So they said, okay, well, major in political science.

00:07:52.728 --> 00:07:54.550
I said, okay.

00:07:55.750 --> 00:07:59.396
And I understand you represented the USA in Turkey's parlance as well.

00:07:59.696 --> 00:08:00.617
Yeah, yeah.

00:08:00.658 --> 00:08:07.206
That was a wonderful tour, six-week tour, which my band took part in.

00:08:07.365 --> 00:08:10.430
And we also had special guests with us.

00:08:10.946 --> 00:08:20.915
We had fantastic veteran blues singer Zora Young from Chicago and also Cedric Burnside.

00:08:21.396 --> 00:08:25.819
So you got the Turkish politicians to play harmonica here in their

00:08:25.839 --> 00:08:27.161
parliament.

00:08:27.482 --> 00:08:27.841
Yeah.

00:08:28.302 --> 00:08:32.966
Matter of fact, I think the clip is available on YouTube.

00:08:33.427 --> 00:08:34.587
I'll try and post it on the podcast.

00:08:35.129 --> 00:08:35.889
Yeah, yeah.

00:08:35.929 --> 00:08:40.193
We have the leader, two leaders of the opposition parties.

00:08:40.769 --> 00:08:49.942
The Liberal Party representative was a very renowned Turkish folk singer.

00:08:50.903 --> 00:08:59.073
And we had an impromptu jam session with the members of parliament.

00:08:59.514 --> 00:09:02.298
And she joined in.

00:09:02.339 --> 00:09:05.322
And we were just kind of jamming some blues.

00:09:05.482 --> 00:09:07.666
And she joined in singing in Turkish.

00:09:08.769 --> 00:09:33.789
I'm having a time with you I'm having a time with you

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We just gave a few of them harmonicas, and she played a little harmonica.

00:09:44.910 --> 00:09:45.571
It was great.

00:09:45.991 --> 00:09:46.692
You've got to see it.

00:09:46.753 --> 00:09:47.653
It's really cool.

00:09:48.153 --> 00:09:48.774
Next one.

00:09:48.793 --> 00:09:50.735
Cedric Burnside's playing guitar.

00:09:50.816 --> 00:09:55.620
I'm playing Harb Zor Young's singing, and it was really cool.

00:09:56.802 --> 00:09:57.241
Awesome, yeah.

00:09:57.702 --> 00:10:04.950
Talking about your music career, you played with Carrie Bell, and then you went on to replace him in the Willie Dixon All-Star Band.

00:10:05.711 --> 00:10:06.191
I did.

00:10:06.230 --> 00:10:13.357
Although, Carrie Bell, I have on a cassette tape It was kind of weird because, yeah, I was replacing Cary Bell.

00:10:14.077 --> 00:10:16.340
And Willie Dixon knew that he was going to leave.

00:10:16.681 --> 00:10:23.626
And he actually, I got to accompany the band while they were on tour, while Cary was still playing.

00:10:23.706 --> 00:10:30.634
So I was kind of like an apprentice harmonica player for the Willie Dixon Chicago All-Stars, yeah.

00:10:31.254 --> 00:10:38.922
My first band, and right prior to that, was with a boogie-woogie piano player.

00:10:39.586 --> 00:10:41.967
from Memphis by the name of Jimmy Walker.

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He gave me my first real break to be in a regular, to be in a band on a regular basis.

00:10:48.554 --> 00:10:55.822
And we started out as the Jimmy Walker Trio with just guitar, harp, and piano.

00:10:56.081 --> 00:10:59.206
My buddy Pete Crawford on guitar.

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And then eventually we added bass and drums.

00:11:01.768 --> 00:11:07.614
But he was really, I remember him fondly, and I really miss him.

00:11:07.841 --> 00:11:09.865
miss him because he was a great guy.

00:11:10.044 --> 00:11:14.971
I always credit him with giving me my first break, so to speak.

00:11:35.874 --> 00:11:38.498
And what sort of age were you when you joined Willie Dixon's family?

00:11:39.539 --> 00:11:41.201
That was just a few years after that.

00:11:42.403 --> 00:11:50.677
Right after that, we had formed the Sons of Blues because we went to a historic...

00:11:51.357 --> 00:11:57.187
We performed a historic concert at the Berlin Jazz Festival in 1977.

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That was then.

00:11:59.510 --> 00:12:03.798
So that was myself, Freddie Dixon...

00:12:04.354 --> 00:12:08.158
Lurie Bell and Garland Whiteside.

00:12:08.739 --> 00:12:15.488
So everyone in that rhythm section was a son of a famous blues musician except for myself.

00:12:15.807 --> 00:12:20.474
But Willie Dixon was with us as the emcee and the patriarchal figure.

00:12:21.154 --> 00:12:25.539
And that concert, there's two documentaries on YouTube.

00:12:25.801 --> 00:12:27.121
One's an extension of the other.

00:12:27.682 --> 00:12:29.524
That's also on YouTube too.

00:12:30.606 --> 00:12:38.652
One's called Willie Dixon and the New Blues Generation, and the other one is I Am the Blues.

00:12:39.113 --> 00:12:40.715
Roy, I'll post links to those as well.

00:12:40.835 --> 00:12:41.436
I'm sure I'll find

00:12:41.796 --> 00:12:41.996
those.

00:12:42.136 --> 00:13:05.870
Yeah, they're really, really interesting because Jim and Amy O'Neill, the publishers of Living Blues, they were commissioned by George Brunt, who was the producer of the Berlin Jazz Festival, to assemble a group of At that time, youngsters, we were the answer to the question, are there any young black people playing blues?

00:13:05.971 --> 00:13:11.941
So they assembled five of us comprised in three rhythm sections.

00:13:12.442 --> 00:13:15.647
The Sons of Blues was born as a result of that.

00:13:16.187 --> 00:13:23.139
So then that stage in the 1970s, there was less interest in the young black guys in blues then?

00:13:23.840 --> 00:13:27.485
Well, there was so much less interest.

00:13:27.586 --> 00:13:43.826
There weren't a lot of us, but this kind of highlighted the fact that there were a handful and that we were all pretty skilled at what we were at our craft.

00:13:44.347 --> 00:13:51.216
Yeah, you were in good company there, as you say, the sons of famous musicians and then Willie Dixon himself.

00:13:51.236 --> 00:13:51.837
Right.

00:13:52.097 --> 00:13:53.981
We're talking about some of the awards you've won.

00:13:54.022 --> 00:13:57.388
I understand you've received three Grammy nominations.

00:13:58.009 --> 00:13:59.351
Were they for your albums?

00:13:59.932 --> 00:14:00.153
Right.

00:14:00.234 --> 00:14:04.422
They were the first one right after that concert.

00:14:04.461 --> 00:14:09.792
Matter of fact, shortly thereafter, we recorded for Alligator, Living Chicago Blues, Volume 3.

00:14:09.812 --> 00:14:40.541
¶¶ I think we received that in 79, 78, 79.

00:14:41.923 --> 00:14:49.577
And then one was for Superharps with myself, Charlie Musselwhite, James Cotton, Sugar Ray Norcia.

00:14:50.078 --> 00:14:51.421
I have the album Superharps.

00:14:51.480 --> 00:14:52.903
I listened to that a lot when I was younger.

00:14:52.943 --> 00:14:53.684
Yeah, I remember it well.

00:14:58.133 --> 00:15:00.638
Mean little momma, slow your rolling down.

00:15:00.929 --> 00:15:11.284
And the other one is for Chicago Blues Living History with myself, John Primer, Billy Boy Arnold, Carlos Johnson, Lurie Bell.

00:15:11.764 --> 00:15:15.210
So did you go to the Grammy ceremony when you were nominated for those?

00:15:16.572 --> 00:15:17.614
Yeah, I went twice.

00:15:17.634 --> 00:15:25.403
And the last time for the Chicago Blues Living History, we actually expected to win.

00:15:26.485 --> 00:15:29.129
And because it was a very well...

00:15:29.634 --> 00:15:35.922
produced a record complete with great liner note booklet and photography.

00:15:35.942 --> 00:15:39.727
And the musicianship was top notch.

00:15:41.109 --> 00:15:42.471
And we were there.

00:15:43.211 --> 00:15:50.461
And this was actually produced by Larry Scholar, who lives in Nice, France, but he's American.

00:15:50.501 --> 00:15:57.971
And Larry had the support of the French government in Aulnay-sur-Bois.

00:15:58.432 --> 00:15:58.974
And they...

00:15:59.714 --> 00:16:26.259
The mayor from that town and various dignitaries were there at the Grammys, and we're all there, and Lurie Bell's there, and John Primer, and we're all just sitting, and, you know, we almost, I said, maybe I should have written an acceptance speech, and Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis, you know, producers of the time and Prince, they were the presenters, and when they read the...

00:16:27.740 --> 00:16:28.761
And the winner is...

00:16:29.313 --> 00:16:44.989
Now, the Blues, of course, is not televised, but they have a ceremony for the so-called lesser commercial categories, which I think is a travesty, but that's another interview.

00:16:45.830 --> 00:16:54.999
But you see your name flash up on the big screen, and the winner is Ramblin' Jack Elliott.

00:16:55.860 --> 00:16:56.421
And we're like,

00:16:57.061 --> 00:16:57.662
whoo!

00:16:58.049 --> 00:17:10.487
And I never heard of him, but apparently he's a veteran folk singer, songwriter, guitarist, and apparently was a mentor to Bob Dylan.

00:17:11.167 --> 00:17:15.354
And so we kind of connected the dots and said, oh.

00:17:17.436 --> 00:17:22.844
You were also on the Grammy Board of Governors as well for the blues category.

00:17:24.006 --> 00:17:24.145
Yeah.

00:17:24.385 --> 00:17:26.367
Well, I was, yes.

00:17:26.648 --> 00:17:32.016
I started the first blues committee as a governor.

00:17:32.777 --> 00:17:35.519
And you won a couple of WC Handy Awards as well?

00:17:36.221 --> 00:17:38.063
Yeah, I got three of those.

00:17:38.963 --> 00:17:41.446
They were Handys, now they're BMAs.

00:17:43.150 --> 00:17:44.490
One for Harper Tech.

00:17:44.832 --> 00:17:47.275
One for Chicago Blues, A Living History.

00:17:47.355 --> 00:17:48.717
That might have been Volume 2.

00:17:49.538 --> 00:17:50.818
And one for...

00:17:50.838 --> 00:17:52.642
Oh, me and Kenny Neal.

00:18:07.362 --> 00:18:22.519
Double Take, best acoustic album.

00:18:23.300 --> 00:18:29.548
And then a couple of BMAs for my work with Blues in Schools, Keeping the Blues Alive Awards.

00:18:30.249 --> 00:18:32.291
Yeah, I was going to ask you about the Blues in Schools.

00:18:32.652 --> 00:18:33.913
Yeah, you know, I did a...

00:18:34.306 --> 00:18:38.372
Blues in Schools performance in Jersey at Giles' old school.

00:18:39.012 --> 00:18:40.335
I didn't play at his school.

00:18:40.434 --> 00:18:42.519
I knew that you'd played in Jersey recently.

00:18:43.800 --> 00:18:45.262
Yeah, we played at his school.

00:18:47.205 --> 00:18:48.067
It was surreal.

00:18:49.169 --> 00:18:51.553
We felt like we were in a Harry Potter movie.

00:18:52.954 --> 00:18:54.636
It looked just like it.

00:18:54.737 --> 00:18:59.825
I mean, it was the old decor and the architecture.

00:18:59.944 --> 00:19:02.710
It was really surreal.

00:19:03.170 --> 00:19:06.255
And did the students like the concert?

00:19:06.674 --> 00:19:07.436
Oh, they loved it.

00:19:08.117 --> 00:19:16.490
I had them singing Stormy Monday at the top of their lungs and standing up and raising their hands and screaming, Lord have mercy.

00:19:18.354 --> 00:19:23.862
Well, let's hope you've got a new jowl coming through then from Jersey as a result of that.

00:19:24.542 --> 00:19:24.903
Yeah,

00:19:25.244 --> 00:19:27.047
yeah, yeah, possibly.

00:19:27.086 --> 00:19:28.990
Great that you're keeping the blues alive.

00:19:29.029 --> 00:19:30.613
And clearly with your...

00:19:31.586 --> 00:19:41.720
Your band name is Sons of the Blues, so you've clearly got this strong feeling about keeping the blues going and the history and the legacy of blues music.

00:19:42.721 --> 00:19:49.150
Well, the reason was because every member, except for myself, was the son of a famous blues musician.

00:19:49.711 --> 00:20:04.814
But consistent with that theme, we certainly were actively pursuing the goal in addition to Our careers, but kind of spreading the word, so to speak.

00:20:06.036 --> 00:20:23.994
We did something kind of unique, Neil, here in Chicago, in that as a younger band, we ended up playing in neighborhood black-owned taverns, which normally their clientele would not be so blues-oriented.

00:20:24.454 --> 00:20:30.342
The blues, contrary to probably a lot of people's beliefs, is not...

00:20:30.817 --> 00:20:32.861
really popular in black communities.

00:20:33.301 --> 00:20:50.028
Don't get me wrong, you have a lot of black people that still like the blues, but in terms of attendance in the clubs, like Buddy Guys and the clubs on the north side, the audiences are primarily non-African American.

00:20:51.148 --> 00:21:01.641
And when we put our band together in the late 70s, We would play in clubs that, I'll give you an example.

00:21:02.162 --> 00:21:13.740
Some of these clubs were, the clientele was middle class and upper middle class black people, sometimes celebrities and politicians and locals, Chicago.

00:21:14.381 --> 00:21:24.958
And then they weren't all like that, but they were neighborhood bars that people normally who came in there would not have gone out of their way to go hear a blues concert.

00:21:25.250 --> 00:21:36.368
So we, in effect, baptized our own people because we were playing at such a high level that they couldn't deny us.

00:21:37.049 --> 00:21:43.520
There's a stigma attached to the blues within the African-American community.

00:21:44.142 --> 00:21:48.229
And part of it has to do with remembering the South and hard times.

00:21:48.348 --> 00:21:51.334
These are things that some people would rather forget.

00:21:51.713 --> 00:21:58.862
And there's always been the debate about is the blues low down, whereas jazz is classy.

00:21:59.001 --> 00:22:02.766
You know, there's always that kind of a debate as well.

00:22:02.986 --> 00:22:18.782
So in essence, we reintroduced our culture to the people who were the inheritors of that culture, who had basically had shunned it or turned their back on it.

00:22:18.804 --> 00:22:19.683
I'll give you an example.

00:22:19.825 --> 00:22:20.846
One club we went in.

00:22:21.634 --> 00:22:26.501
We went in, we did our regular show, and then the people turned their noses up.

00:22:26.541 --> 00:22:27.523
This is a black club.

00:22:27.564 --> 00:22:31.289
They turned and they looked at us like we stole something.

00:22:31.630 --> 00:22:36.238
But within one month, we'd walk in and they'd say, are you all going to play the blues tonight?

00:22:37.760 --> 00:22:39.703
Because they couldn't deny.

00:22:39.743 --> 00:22:41.826
And the blues is like that.

00:22:42.729 --> 00:22:48.097
Because it's, you know, I've said many times that it's the...

00:22:48.546 --> 00:23:10.997
most universal of all musics because it speaks directly to the human condition it's everyone has the blues from time to time you can't say i got the hip-hop i got the jazz i got the you know i got the whatever but everyone gets the blues so therefore on some level everybody can relate to it

00:23:11.837 --> 00:23:16.751
yeah definitely certainly for myself when i was younger blues was a You know, very important to me.

00:23:16.912 --> 00:23:17.773
It's the music I love.

00:23:17.854 --> 00:23:19.236
And I started playing the harmonica, yeah.

00:23:19.256 --> 00:23:24.103
So certainly for me, I grew up in northern England, you know, a long way from where the blues came from.

00:23:24.284 --> 00:23:24.784
Yeah.

00:23:25.465 --> 00:23:27.929
If we can move on to talk about some of your albums now.

00:23:28.390 --> 00:23:31.815
You mentioned, I think, the Chicago's Young Blues Generation.

00:23:32.036 --> 00:23:35.140
That's the first album you wrote in 1982.

00:23:35.942 --> 00:23:37.564
Yeah, that was out in 82.

00:23:37.644 --> 00:23:43.874
Yeah, that was in conjunction with the American Folk Music Tour.

00:23:44.385 --> 00:23:45.907
for Horst Lippmann and Raoul.

00:23:46.048 --> 00:23:52.597
You know, they were the first entrepreneurs to start bringing blues to Europe on a regular basis.

00:23:53.619 --> 00:24:00.229
Going back with Muddy and Willie Dixon and Sonny Boy and Little Walls, so many of them that they brought over.

00:24:00.269 --> 00:24:04.015
And so we did that, yeah, for that organization.

00:24:04.675 --> 00:24:06.719
You mentioned the album Heart Attack.

00:24:07.038 --> 00:24:09.623
Yeah, so Heart Attack was the first time I heard you.

00:24:09.722 --> 00:24:10.765
And yeah, the great album.

00:24:10.825 --> 00:24:14.049
And again, when I was growing up and playing the harmonica, that was a...

00:24:14.498 --> 00:24:17.000
an album I played along my harmonica to a lot.

00:24:17.500 --> 00:24:20.824
Obviously, you had yourself on there and Carrie Bell and James Cotton Jr.

00:24:20.844 --> 00:24:22.665
Well, so how did that album come about?

00:24:23.267 --> 00:24:31.835
That was on Alligator Records and Bruce Eagle Hour, the owner and producer, he came up with the idea.

00:24:31.875 --> 00:24:48.038
And prior to that, he had done similar formats with guitars, you know, the guitar showdown and he had Texas guitar showdown, you know, where he had like four different guitar players, you know.

00:24:48.838 --> 00:24:53.884
And he envisioned that same concept, but using harp players.

00:24:54.064 --> 00:25:09.298
And he had assembled, now he's related to me this story several times, and he had already assembled Kerry Bell, who I knew, spent a lot of time with, of course.

00:25:10.059 --> 00:25:12.162
Well, I spent a lot of time with all of them, actually.

00:25:12.769 --> 00:25:16.678
Junior Wells, and James Cotton.

00:25:17.219 --> 00:25:24.232
And these, along with Big Walter Horton, these were my principal influences.

00:25:24.292 --> 00:25:28.401
These are the guys that I would hang out with at the clubs.

00:25:28.993 --> 00:25:35.323
Get my ass kicked, get blown off the stage by each and every one of them numerous times over the years.

00:25:35.403 --> 00:25:35.603
Yeah,

00:25:35.943 --> 00:25:37.766
you talked about that on the album, didn't you?

00:25:37.807 --> 00:25:41.652
You say that you used to cut my head regularly and all these things.

00:25:41.852 --> 00:25:42.692
Yeah,

00:25:42.953 --> 00:25:43.755
yeah, yeah.

00:25:43.775 --> 00:25:45.017
A new kid on the block.

00:25:45.196 --> 00:25:47.339
Yeah, all of that is true.

00:25:47.380 --> 00:25:48.602
Every verse...

00:25:48.993 --> 00:25:52.979
Every verse in that song is accurate.

00:26:20.034 --> 00:26:27.082
So he assembled the three of them, and he asked them, he said, we need a fourth harmonica player.

00:26:28.063 --> 00:26:32.106
And so he asked them, and they all unanimously said, get Billy.

00:26:32.428 --> 00:26:37.093
That was a great honor for me, and it was a lot of fun.

00:26:37.693 --> 00:26:44.922
I remember when I cut New Kid on the Block, Junior Wells, right after we did it, he said, don't F with it.

00:26:46.403 --> 00:26:47.124
I said, what?

00:26:47.344 --> 00:26:48.025
Leave it alone.

00:26:48.105 --> 00:26:48.625
In other words...

00:26:48.961 --> 00:26:52.326
I think we did that on one take, and that was it.

00:26:52.346 --> 00:26:52.826
It's

00:26:52.886 --> 00:26:53.788
a great, great song.

00:26:53.807 --> 00:26:54.528
Yeah, I know it well.

00:26:54.588 --> 00:26:54.930
Thanks.

00:26:55.329 --> 00:26:59.556
Playing on that one, you're playing with James Cotton, and you have that kind of blow-off on the end of the song.

00:26:59.615 --> 00:27:07.426
And James Cotton plays this really laid-back sort of riff, which is beautiful, against your kind of attacking sort of style of harmonica.

00:27:07.446 --> 00:27:09.169
It's a really nice combination.

00:27:22.721 --> 00:27:49.123
Yeah, thanks, man.

00:27:49.182 --> 00:27:51.006
I miss those guys, those cats.

00:27:51.233 --> 00:27:53.577
I learned so much from those guys.

00:27:54.097 --> 00:27:57.983
So lucky, like you say, you were hanging out with those guys and learning directly from those guys.

00:27:58.023 --> 00:28:01.529
I think a lot of harmonica players give their right arm for that.

00:28:03.692 --> 00:28:05.296
Any particular advice to give you?

00:28:05.916 --> 00:28:06.217
Well,

00:28:06.477 --> 00:28:23.317
yeah, it wasn't like they would welcome you with open arms because at that time there were so many really skilled Chicago musicians In the clubs, you know, it was always loose.

00:28:23.357 --> 00:28:23.979
You know, people...

00:28:24.519 --> 00:28:25.340
And it still is.

00:28:25.421 --> 00:28:28.003
We still have that kind of family thing.

00:28:28.064 --> 00:28:34.332
Like, for example, if I walk in, just say Little Ed's playing or Ronnie Baker Brooks or something.

00:28:34.352 --> 00:28:37.916
I walk in, the first thing they're going to say, hey, man, we're in the key of A.

00:28:38.877 --> 00:28:39.839
Get your D harp.

00:28:39.960 --> 00:28:41.321
You know, I mean, we've always...

00:28:41.890 --> 00:28:48.538
Chicago has always had that kind of welcome vibe when it comes to us sharing the stage.

00:28:48.598 --> 00:28:50.121
We've always done that.

00:28:50.181 --> 00:28:53.204
I've seen it from the beginning when I first entered the scene.

00:28:53.704 --> 00:28:59.211
It kind of disturbs me when I've traveled different places and I see these guys.

00:28:59.932 --> 00:29:01.255
They're so stringent.

00:29:01.315 --> 00:29:05.721
They're so almost as if you're insulting them.

00:29:06.121 --> 00:29:09.885
You say, well, hey, I've got an instrument and they're so stringent.

00:29:10.498 --> 00:29:23.670
I don't know what the word is, mercenary about it, the territorial, because that's not the way that I learned, and that's not the way we do here in Chicago.

00:29:23.690 --> 00:29:25.672
It's very, very gracious.

00:29:26.113 --> 00:29:27.134
It's not uncommon.

00:29:27.193 --> 00:29:36.221
Just say, if you say, hey, man, I'm from England, and I know Billy Branch, and I play harp, chances are they say, well, you got your harp?

00:29:36.281 --> 00:29:37.002
Come on up here.

00:29:37.702 --> 00:29:40.326
So there was a competition level.

00:29:40.705 --> 00:29:47.656
So, in other words, by now I've, you know, gotten a little notoriety.

00:29:48.438 --> 00:30:01.116
If I'm in the house and James Cotton's in the house or Junior Will and I'm going to, if they know I might play, they're going to try their best to cut my hair.

00:30:01.136 --> 00:30:02.018
You see what I'm saying?

00:30:03.019 --> 00:30:12.125
So, it was, but it was, you know, it wasn't, it was never house style, but it was just, It was healthy competition.

00:30:12.646 --> 00:30:17.757
I'm sure that helped draw the best out of you and push your playing on to the heights that you've reached.

00:30:17.856 --> 00:30:18.237
Oh, it

00:30:18.258 --> 00:30:18.498
did.

00:30:19.759 --> 00:30:25.411
I was like the little kid that kept going to the playground and getting knocked down by the bully.

00:30:27.074 --> 00:30:29.097
I just kept coming back for more until...

00:30:29.761 --> 00:30:33.888
So when the bully hit me, I didn't fall down anymore,

00:30:35.751 --> 00:30:36.733
you know.

00:30:51.458 --> 00:30:54.762
That is obviously a Little Walter tribute album.

00:30:55.624 --> 00:30:58.449
What made you want to do a Little Walter tribute album?

00:30:58.848 --> 00:30:59.109
Well,

00:30:59.190 --> 00:31:01.613
actually, in the beginning, I didn't want to do it.

00:31:01.953 --> 00:31:10.145
I had to be convinced by my wife and Little Walter's daughter, Marion Diaz, who appears on the album.

00:31:10.446 --> 00:31:13.111
Yeah, that's a nice touch.

00:31:13.290 --> 00:31:13.791
Yeah.

00:31:14.712 --> 00:31:18.538
You know, we're part of the Little Walter Foundation, my wife and I.

00:31:18.638 --> 00:31:20.481
My wife is currently the director, and...

00:31:21.314 --> 00:31:26.101
We developed a close relationship with Mary and Little Walter's daughter.

00:31:26.221 --> 00:31:41.503
The 50th anniversary of his passing was coming up, and we did the tribute to Little Walter at the Mainstage Chicago Blues Festival in 2018, 50th anniversary.

00:31:41.564 --> 00:31:47.053
So it made sense to do something to commemorate that.

00:31:47.113 --> 00:31:54.664
But initially I pushed back because I was like, you know, there's been so many tribute to little waltz records.

00:31:54.765 --> 00:31:56.288
Do we need another one?

00:31:56.367 --> 00:32:03.741
And my wife said, well, you know, it'd be important that you do this, especially with Marion being on it, you know, his daughter.

00:32:03.821 --> 00:32:04.784
And I said, okay.

00:32:04.844 --> 00:32:23.116
And after we got engaged in the process, it started, you know, this song started morphing and taking on a life of their own and we ended up with what I consider a very good recording because my band really rose to the occasion.

00:32:23.458 --> 00:32:24.679
It's an excellent recording.

00:32:24.739 --> 00:32:32.007
I think you add, like you say, there's been a lot of Little Walter tribute albums, but you definitely add your own flavor to it and some great playing on there.

00:32:32.086 --> 00:32:39.515
You know, some of the songs you've taken quite a long way away from the Little Walter version, such as Mellow Down Easy, which is probably my all-time favorite Little Walter song.

00:32:40.296 --> 00:32:41.497
You know, you do that very differently.

00:32:41.537 --> 00:32:42.798
First of all, it's in a different key.

00:32:42.818 --> 00:32:44.259
It's in E and not in A.

00:32:45.481 --> 00:32:46.182
Yeah.

00:32:46.281 --> 00:32:48.805
It's got a completely different vibe about it, doesn't it?

00:32:53.230 --> 00:32:53.309
Yeah.

00:33:00.769 --> 00:33:10.064
than juke yeah is quite similar but again a number is different enough that you know it kind of is juke isn't it but you've added your own flavor on top of it again

00:33:10.765 --> 00:33:31.740
yeah with juke i'm i'm playing almost note for note with little walter played but we put a completely different rhythm to it so you know and and it came out to be refreshing because i've never uh been one to just want to recreate what other people have done, you know, just copy, copy, you know.

00:33:32.040 --> 00:33:32.942
I mean, what's the point?

00:33:33.604 --> 00:33:38.511
It became a creative effort, and the band was as much a part of it as I was.

00:33:38.592 --> 00:33:40.174
They came up with a lot of ideas.

00:33:40.816 --> 00:33:44.021
So I'm really pleased with what came out.

00:33:44.663 --> 00:33:45.904
Yeah, it's really great.

00:33:45.924 --> 00:33:46.405
I enjoyed it.

00:33:47.137 --> 00:33:53.165
So before then, I think you'd released 2014's Blue Shock, so that was five years before.

00:33:53.226 --> 00:33:53.807
And then before

00:33:53.926 --> 00:33:54.548
that,

00:33:54.948 --> 00:33:58.713
there'd been quite a gap of, I think, a 10-year gap between a studio

00:33:59.173 --> 00:33:59.273
album.

00:34:00.055 --> 00:34:16.818
Yeah, more than that, closer to 15, that we did something that, I mean, I continue to record as a session man, and I may have done some compilation stuff, but in terms of on my own group, yeah, it'd been a good while.

00:34:17.282 --> 00:34:18.264
I mean, it was time.

00:34:18.344 --> 00:34:20.829
It was already five years since Blue Shock.

00:34:21.710 --> 00:34:26.117
And I'm trying to make it not another five years before the next one.

00:34:26.177 --> 00:34:31.949
I'm writing some things and trying to get material for the next release.

00:34:32.489 --> 00:34:34.152
What's your favorite song on the album?

00:34:34.172 --> 00:34:34.693
That's funny.

00:34:34.733 --> 00:34:34.793
I

00:34:34.813 --> 00:34:36.137
was kind of thinking about that.

00:34:36.177 --> 00:34:40.405
One of my favorites is Blue and Lonesome.

00:34:51.425 --> 00:34:53.528
You start playing chromatic and then you switch to diatonic.

00:34:53.588 --> 00:34:54.170
Is that that one?

00:34:54.469 --> 00:34:54.931
Yes.

00:34:55.672 --> 00:35:01.780
That's another example of how we modified and added our own touch to that.

00:35:02.101 --> 00:35:04.344
Because, you know, traditionally it's...

00:35:05.085 --> 00:35:10.532
Lil' Walter plays chromatic throughout and then we took it into a different mode, you know.

00:35:10.552 --> 00:35:13.637
I hate to see you go and mellow down easy.

00:35:13.757 --> 00:35:17.402
Oh, we have a video on mellow down easy.

00:35:18.282 --> 00:35:20.286
Move on now to...

00:35:20.481 --> 00:35:22.905
talking about some of the harmonic influences on you.

00:35:23.425 --> 00:35:27.833
Is there any particular albums that you listen to, any particular songs that influence you?

00:35:28.673 --> 00:35:28.974
Well,

00:35:29.795 --> 00:35:36.885
I listen to Lalo, Walter, Lalo, Sonny Boy, and then I would go to hear Junior and Cotton and Carrie Bell.

00:35:50.177 --> 00:35:51.880
and Big Walter here.

00:35:51.920 --> 00:35:53.942
They're alive, you know, a lot.

00:35:54.262 --> 00:35:58.447
The first two people most everyone says is Little Walter and Sonny Boy Williams.

00:35:59.306 --> 00:35:59.987
What is it you think

00:36:00.128 --> 00:36:02.931
about those guys, you know, won people over to their music?

00:36:03.351 --> 00:36:17.045
Even though they were both from the South, they had a commercial appeal, almost like, you know, almost like a pop kind of appeal because the recordings were produced on such a high level.

00:36:17.378 --> 00:36:35.358
And you take a song like Help Me, which is about as simple as you can get.

00:36:35.378 --> 00:36:43.967
But the way that Sonny Boy delivers this is just so geniusly constructed.

00:36:44.748 --> 00:36:46.409
And it's so catchy.

00:36:47.170 --> 00:36:49.472
And it's not a lot of instrumentation.

00:36:49.592 --> 00:36:54.699
It's not a lot of flashy harmonica playing, but it's so soulful.

00:36:55.599 --> 00:37:08.353
And his voice and his vibrato in his voice and the vibrato in his harp playing, it just reaches out to you, you know.

00:37:08.373 --> 00:37:11.637
And little Walter, you know, again with his...

00:37:12.130 --> 00:37:20.159
Virtuosity and the arrangements and the rhythm section, just well-oiled machine.

00:37:20.980 --> 00:37:29.148
It's like all the notes just fit where they were supposed to be, almost like our favorite pop songs were.

00:37:29.909 --> 00:37:35.797
For blues, you don't necessarily make that kind of association.

00:37:36.376 --> 00:37:37.978
Did you see those guys play

00:37:37.998 --> 00:37:38.480
yourself?

00:37:39.019 --> 00:37:40.282
No, I came too late.

00:37:40.545 --> 00:37:43.009
I didn't come to Chicago until 69.

00:37:43.168 --> 00:37:45.231
Walter died in 68.

00:37:45.952 --> 00:37:48.554
Sonny Boy a few years before that.

00:37:48.574 --> 00:37:51.278
You did sit in with Muddy Waters at one point, didn't

00:37:52.079 --> 00:37:52.139
you?

00:37:52.159 --> 00:37:52.280
Yeah,

00:37:52.360 --> 00:37:54.682
I got a couple of times to sit in with Muddy.

00:37:54.702 --> 00:37:58.606
I got to see him several times, not as much as I would have liked to.

00:37:58.987 --> 00:38:00.028
Was that when he was

00:38:00.068 --> 00:38:02.010
playing in Chicago and you were sitting with him?

00:38:02.771 --> 00:38:03.152
Oh, yeah.

00:38:03.833 --> 00:38:06.516
He never asked you to become one of his harmonica players of choice?

00:38:07.177 --> 00:38:07.617
No.

00:38:08.353 --> 00:38:25.699
I know at one point there was talk about me possibly playing with Coco Taylor, which I recorded on three or maybe four Coco Taylor's albums, but not with Muddy during the time it might have been possible.

00:38:25.719 --> 00:38:29.505
Of course, I was with Dixon, and those were...

00:38:29.985 --> 00:38:34.954
If you were a sideman as a harp player, those were the two golden gigs to get.

00:38:35.195 --> 00:38:39.503
He only had those two, either Muddy Waters or Willie Dichter.

00:38:40.324 --> 00:38:45.014
Fortunately, at least, I could play with Willie for about six years.

00:38:46.036 --> 00:38:51.326
We touched on earlier on that clearly you know Giles Robson, who I did the last podcast with.

00:38:51.554 --> 00:38:59.130
So Giles has brought you over to the UK a few times, and Europe, so you've toured in Europe and the UK, playing with Giles' band.

00:38:59.472 --> 00:38:59.612
So

00:38:59.652 --> 00:38:59.913
how did

00:38:59.932 --> 00:39:00.514
that come about?

00:39:01.315 --> 00:39:02.800
Giles initiated that.

00:39:03.221 --> 00:39:13.161
You know, I had played in the UK, but never in the London area, and Like the Great Rhythm and Blues Festival, I'd done that a couple of times.

00:39:13.702 --> 00:39:22.112
I even did a blues in schools for a week in the UK in conjunction with that festival for a week and went to five schools during that week.

00:39:22.431 --> 00:39:24.875
Is that the one in Burnley in Lancashire?

00:39:24.994 --> 00:39:25.474
Yes.

00:39:25.856 --> 00:39:30.420
So my hometown is about 10 miles from there, so I used to go to that festival when I was young.

00:39:30.541 --> 00:39:32.543
It was kind of one of my big blues influences.

00:39:32.762 --> 00:39:35.967
We had that festival, and then there was another one in Colne also in Lancashire.

00:39:36.086 --> 00:39:38.690
Yeah, in Colne, I did that one too.

00:39:39.137 --> 00:39:42.483
Yeah, so you came over and you played with Giles.

00:39:42.804 --> 00:39:51.818
I know, as you say, you came over to Jersey and I saw you play at Burnley when Sugar Blue came over as well, just a few years ago now.

00:39:52.378 --> 00:39:53.679
Yeah, yeah.

00:39:53.740 --> 00:39:54.561
Who was it?

00:39:54.601 --> 00:39:58.186
It was me, Sugar Blue, Charlie Musselwhite.

00:39:59.009 --> 00:39:59.128
You

00:39:59.168 --> 00:39:59.530
talked about

00:39:59.570 --> 00:40:00.010
your band

00:40:00.110 --> 00:40:04.077
and would you have any advice for up-and-coming blues bands?

00:40:04.597 --> 00:40:07.561
You know, the main thing, do your homework and practice.

00:40:07.905 --> 00:40:09.771
Practice, practice, practice, of course.

00:40:10.414 --> 00:40:17.074
But do your homework because Giles, he keeps some quality musicians.

00:40:17.697 --> 00:40:18.719
to his credit.

00:40:19.079 --> 00:40:24.463
And so when he said, you know, it's really challenging when you're playing with a pickup band.

00:40:24.625 --> 00:40:31.411
You know, you can never really do, as a band leader, you can never really do what you can do with your own band.

00:40:31.451 --> 00:40:34.954
But at least if you've got good musicians, you can come pretty damn close.

00:40:35.695 --> 00:40:40.099
And to Giles' credit, he's, you know, he's like the Cinelli brothers.

00:40:40.179 --> 00:40:41.960
Those guys are great.

00:40:42.561 --> 00:40:46.324
He's always kept top-notch musicians in the UK.

00:40:46.364 --> 00:40:49.842
So, It makes it a lot easier.

00:40:50.943 --> 00:41:00.518
But these guys, they've done their homework, and they know the idiom, even when I did with Lewis Fielding, which we just did as a duo.

00:41:01.300 --> 00:41:04.244
Lewis was an excellent accompanist.

00:41:04.644 --> 00:41:12.898
And then you've got to respect the music, and you've got to respect where it comes from, and understand that this is a legacy.

00:41:13.474 --> 00:41:22.465
Of course, now it's an important aspect of world culture, but it's an important cornerstone of African-American culture as well.

00:41:22.605 --> 00:41:27.570
I think the respect and the reverence is also important.

00:41:28.251 --> 00:41:28.952
Yeah, and

00:41:28.972 --> 00:41:29.072
the

00:41:29.112 --> 00:41:30.494
foundation for rock and roll.

00:41:31.115 --> 00:41:31.396
Right.

00:41:32.016 --> 00:41:36.802
It basically spawned the British blues invasion.

00:41:37.123 --> 00:41:39.206
I mean, the British rock invasion.

00:41:39.617 --> 00:41:40.378
That's right.

00:41:40.418 --> 00:41:49.788
When the Beatles came over to America, I believe one of the first things they said was, they mentioned Woody Walters, and the journalists in America didn't know who Woody Walters was.

00:41:50.347 --> 00:41:53.311
Yeah,

00:41:53.331 --> 00:41:53.510
yeah, yeah.

00:41:53.530 --> 00:41:54.853
It's a place, apparently.

00:41:55.092 --> 00:41:56.074
They didn't know who he was.

00:41:56.094 --> 00:42:08.766
Talking about your playing style now, particularly when I first heard you on Harp Attack, you did bring quite a modern sound to that, you know, with the other guys playing on the album, James Cotton and Junior Osnock.

00:42:09.057 --> 00:42:09.559
Kerry Bell.

00:42:09.938 --> 00:42:10.579
Yeah.

00:42:10.599 --> 00:42:15.166
You know, you, you quite a strong attack on the sound, you know, quite aggressive sound.

00:42:15.226 --> 00:42:19.253
And then you would have a kind of night playing some nice top end stuff coming down.

00:42:19.293 --> 00:42:21.757
How would you say you develop your style?

00:42:22.679 --> 00:42:41.012
I think my style, which is when I, when I related to you about how we appeal to, uh, the people that didn't necessarily, uh, black, uh, African American audiences that were not necessarily blues fans, because, uh, My style is a...

00:42:41.193 --> 00:42:46.737
You know, I'm a product of my musical development as a youngster, you know, and I can't...

00:42:47.719 --> 00:42:51.382
Okay, so I didn't come up listening to blues, what I listen to.

00:42:51.443 --> 00:42:56.007
I listen to everything on the radio, you know, Motown, pop, rock.

00:42:56.206 --> 00:42:59.469
So I'm listening to Stevie Wonder and Jimi Hendrix.

00:42:59.590 --> 00:43:02.452
I'm listening to The Doors, The Beatles, The Stones.

00:43:03.253 --> 00:43:06.657
You know, I'm listening to all of this stuff, like all of this music.

00:43:06.737 --> 00:43:07.157
And so...

00:43:07.585 --> 00:43:12.411
Somewhere in the back of your mind, those influences are there.

00:43:12.451 --> 00:43:16.554
You know, we do some things that are slightly jazzy.

00:43:16.755 --> 00:43:19.356
We can play some light jazz.

00:43:20.077 --> 00:43:25.764
But for me, I think it's just about the groove and it's about the feeling.

00:43:26.304 --> 00:43:33.570
You know, when I perform, sometimes I do these long, fast flourishes, but the blues is not just about that.

00:43:34.271 --> 00:43:36.253
And I feel that sometimes people...

00:43:36.577 --> 00:43:40.686
can overdo that to the extent that it no longer becomes blues.

00:43:40.826 --> 00:43:42.088
It's unrecognizable.

00:43:42.268 --> 00:43:50.704
I mean, yeah, it's great that you're accomplished and you can do these fantastic note runs, but are you playing the blues?

00:43:50.963 --> 00:43:56.233
It becomes questionable because the blues is about the soul, the feeling.

00:43:56.313 --> 00:43:58.177
It's about telling the story, you know?

00:43:58.626 --> 00:44:02.905
I'll refer you to another song on YouTube you may not have heard.

00:44:03.005 --> 00:44:05.518
And I turned Giles on to this some years ago.

00:44:05.538 --> 00:44:06.463
He loves this song.

00:44:06.523 --> 00:44:07.467
It's called Roaches.

00:44:49.985 --> 00:44:51.126
It's real funky.

00:44:52.648 --> 00:45:01.418
It's not really a blues, but to me, in the big picture, it's all the blues because it's all about the soul.

00:45:02.260 --> 00:45:18.077
Even your top jazz musicians in interviews, most of them would say, from Count Basie to Miles Davis, they all say, if you can't play jazz, if you don't know the blues, because it all comes from the blues, you know.

00:45:18.465 --> 00:45:19.286
Yeah, absolutely.

00:45:19.306 --> 00:45:20.907
I love jazz music too.

00:45:20.927 --> 00:45:23.030
A lot of it's based on the blues.

00:45:23.670 --> 00:45:24.050
Yeah.

00:45:24.070 --> 00:45:28.394
A lot of Charlie Parker songs are basically blues songs with jazz chord changes.

00:45:29.335 --> 00:45:31.338
You're the front man for the band.

00:45:31.759 --> 00:45:32.059
Well,

00:45:32.179 --> 00:45:33.360
you know, it's on you.

00:45:33.400 --> 00:45:46.532
It's up to you whether you have a good show, a mediocre show, or it's all on you.

00:45:46.552 --> 00:45:47.012
It's...

00:45:48.161 --> 00:45:50.083
It all falls on your head.

00:45:50.103 --> 00:45:59.094
It doesn't matter if the bass player is messing up or the drummer is messing up or the piano player.

00:46:00.074 --> 00:46:08.784
Ultimately, at the end of it, you get that last note, they're going to say, oh, man, that was terrible.

00:46:08.824 --> 00:46:11.949
Billy Branch did a terrible show.

00:46:12.009 --> 00:46:25.527
So you've got that pressure, and it compels you to, to rise to the occasion, to be able to give a quality performance every time you hit that stage.

00:46:26.027 --> 00:46:30.614
Yeah, but you prefer that, being the frontman, do you, rather than being a sideman?

00:46:30.653 --> 00:46:34.039
You like the pressure, the attitude, how do you think you rise to that?

00:46:35.800 --> 00:46:37.262
You know, I've enjoyed both.

00:46:37.603 --> 00:46:44.494
You know, sometimes it's a relief sometimes when I'm doing a guest spot because you don't have all of that pressure.

00:46:45.153 --> 00:46:59.773
But, you know, I've done this so long, and I've certainly paid enough dues to assume that stature, I guess.

00:47:00.974 --> 00:47:03.719
And I've had enough experience.

00:47:04.740 --> 00:47:10.248
Plus, you make more money as the band leader, you know.

00:47:11.650 --> 00:47:14.474
So that's the bottom line, you know.

00:47:14.786 --> 00:47:27.105
I've been blessed to have always, in all the various incarnations, the Sons of Blues, we've always kept a good band, good, solid-type band.

00:47:28.166 --> 00:47:29.768
You mentioned Blues Chromatic.

00:47:30.789 --> 00:47:35.356
Yeah, how do you think you're playing the Chromatic versus the Diatonic?

00:47:35.376 --> 00:47:37.800
Any tips for people who might want to pick up the Chromatic?

00:47:38.742 --> 00:47:43.889
Well, you know, Blues style, we're basically playing it in the key of D.

00:47:44.481 --> 00:47:52.150
You know, one of my long-term dreams is to play it chromatically like it was made to do.

00:47:52.231 --> 00:47:58.559
But just, again, just listen to the greats, you know.

00:47:59.338 --> 00:48:00.019
Yeah.

00:48:00.239 --> 00:48:03.324
Little Walter did some amazing things with chromatic.

00:48:04.885 --> 00:48:06.807
I am ready for you.

00:48:07.309 --> 00:48:11.773
I hope you're ready for me.

00:48:36.706 --> 00:48:37.547
George Smith.

00:48:38.148 --> 00:48:39.369
I'm Monica George Smith.

00:48:40.070 --> 00:48:42.335
I've got a few gems in there.

00:48:42.375 --> 00:49:00.001
You listen to the guys that appeal to you, you know, and then you can start by copying them and emulating them, and then ultimately, if you can persist, you will hopefully develop your own style.

00:49:00.541 --> 00:49:05.349
But there's nothing wrong with copying, especially when you're first learning, you know.

00:49:05.666 --> 00:49:08.829
Yeah, I always try and encourage people to pick up some chromatic.

00:49:08.849 --> 00:49:15.635
I play quite a lot of chromatic myself, so third position is not really too different than playing the diatonic in third position.

00:49:16.356 --> 00:49:16.556
Yeah.

00:49:17.418 --> 00:49:29.731
A question I ask each time on the podcast is if you had 10 minutes yourself to pick the harmonica up, maybe now or maybe when you were younger starting out, if you only had 10 minutes to play, what would you play in that 10 minutes?

00:49:30.851 --> 00:49:32.614
That's an interesting question.

00:49:33.153 --> 00:49:35.577
It might take me 10 minutes to think about it.

00:49:37.840 --> 00:49:42.226
If I only had 10 minutes to play, I would improvise something for 10 minutes.

00:49:43.047 --> 00:49:44.710
How would you approach the improvisation?

00:49:44.789 --> 00:49:48.135
By playing something in second position or by the blues

00:49:48.175 --> 00:49:49.275
scale?

00:49:49.896 --> 00:50:00.612
It would completely depend on how I felt at that moment, which is the way most of my recordings have been and a lot of my performances.

00:50:00.672 --> 00:50:01.833
When I take a solo...

00:50:02.498 --> 00:50:17.693
There's certain songs that I will play practically the same solo each time, but there's a lot of cases in which I'm learning as I'm going along on any given night.

00:50:18.733 --> 00:50:29.023
This is one reason I'm a person that doesn't mind sitting in because when I'm in different musical settings, I can explore different, experiment on different things.

00:50:29.804 --> 00:50:33.351
So if I have 10 minutes, It would depend on how I felt.

00:50:33.672 --> 00:50:35.614
I'd make up something.

00:50:36.356 --> 00:50:37.998
Do you teach the harmonica?

00:50:38.039 --> 00:50:39.039
Sure.

00:50:39.059 --> 00:50:40.262
Online?

00:50:40.862 --> 00:50:42.324
Not on a regular basis.

00:50:43.907 --> 00:50:48.172
From time to time, people will ask me, and they'll come to my home.

00:50:49.315 --> 00:50:52.039
And I have done lessons over Skype.

00:50:52.760 --> 00:50:56.585
I haven't done it on a regular basis.

00:50:56.724 --> 00:50:58.708
But from time to time, I do.

00:50:58.788 --> 00:50:59.628
And of course, I've taught...

00:51:00.577 --> 00:51:03.860
hundreds of thousands of children over the years.

00:51:04.322 --> 00:51:12.530
I started doing blues in schools in 1978, and I still do it periodically.

00:51:13.851 --> 00:51:23.380
I've got the kids from my 1978 classes who still come to my shows over 40 years later.

00:51:24.161 --> 00:51:26.684
So how do you try and get the kids to play?

00:51:26.744 --> 00:51:28.885
Well, it's not hard.

00:51:29.186 --> 00:51:33.010
You know, they got harmonicas and they make noise.

00:51:34.972 --> 00:51:37.074
You know, kids love to make noise.

00:51:38.976 --> 00:51:40.199
It's not hard at all.

00:51:41.260 --> 00:51:44.523
Okay, and we can move on now to the last section mainly.

00:51:44.603 --> 00:51:45.925
Thanks very much for your time.

00:51:46.246 --> 00:51:47.007
Man, you're doing

00:51:47.067 --> 00:51:48.128
a thorough interview.

00:51:48.148 --> 00:51:50.210
Are you sure you're not writing my biography?

00:51:51.552 --> 00:51:53.054
Maybe I'll come to that.

00:51:53.666 --> 00:51:55.509
If we can talk a bit about gear now.

00:51:56.550 --> 00:51:58.793
So what is your harmonica of choice now?

00:51:58.813 --> 00:52:00.056
Are you still playing the marine bands?

00:52:00.916 --> 00:52:03.260
No, I play Suzuki Manjis.

00:52:04.362 --> 00:52:04.442
Okay.

00:52:05.563 --> 00:52:11.472
And I've been playing them for the last, oh, what is it, about eight years now or seven, eight years.

00:52:12.675 --> 00:52:15.798
And I'm an endorsee.

00:52:17.141 --> 00:52:20.146
And I like them.

00:52:20.326 --> 00:52:21.847
They work really well for me.

00:52:22.829 --> 00:52:22.909
Yeah.

00:52:23.297 --> 00:52:26.121
Yeah, there are definitely good quality harmonicas.

00:52:26.523 --> 00:52:27.103
I have a few.

00:52:27.623 --> 00:52:27.704
Yeah.

00:52:29.206 --> 00:52:32.251
And do you have a favorite key of diatonic harmonica?

00:52:34.213 --> 00:52:39.161
If I was to say, I'd probably say an A harp to play in the key of E.

00:52:40.784 --> 00:52:42.365
Yeah.

00:52:42.425 --> 00:52:45.210
Yeah, the popular choice so far has been the A and B flat.

00:52:45.230 --> 00:52:47.793
They seem to be the ones that people have talked to so far.

00:52:47.833 --> 00:52:50.677
They're the ones leading the way in this question.

00:52:50.697 --> 00:52:50.777
Yeah.

00:52:51.398 --> 00:52:52.681
Yeah, that range is...

00:52:53.826 --> 00:53:01.835
Someone made an interesting point that it's like having, it's like a tenor saxophone range, whereas, you know, higher up you get into an alto saxophone range.

00:53:01.896 --> 00:53:02.016
Yeah.

00:53:02.076 --> 00:53:04.059
It's quite an interesting way to think of it, yeah.

00:53:04.079 --> 00:53:05.960
And do you play any different tunings?

00:53:06.961 --> 00:53:07.322
I don't.

00:53:08.244 --> 00:53:09.826
No, I don't.

00:53:10.467 --> 00:53:11.327
No, I don't.

00:53:11.447 --> 00:53:24.643
I know there's a lot of players that are doing that these days, and I know the overblow technique has really gained a lot of steam over the last couple of decades.

00:53:26.726 --> 00:53:31.454
In that regard, I guess I'm somewhat of a traditionalist.

00:53:32.054 --> 00:53:38.423
I basically play the first, second, and third positions, the standard blues.

00:53:39.164 --> 00:53:42.268
Every once in a while, I might stumble into fourth.

00:53:43.362 --> 00:53:46.748
Yeah, I think that's what works on the diatonic, isn't it?

00:53:46.887 --> 00:53:56.824
I do play mainly just one other tuning, which is the Paddy Ricks, where you just retune the three blow-up a whole tone, so you've got that extra missing note there.

00:53:56.884 --> 00:53:57.164
Oh, okay.

00:53:57.184 --> 00:54:00.690
And that's used for playing melody, you know, being able to play melody.

00:54:01.411 --> 00:54:01.592
Yeah.

00:54:02.052 --> 00:54:02.532
Cool.

00:54:03.173 --> 00:54:04.896
And what about amplifiers?

00:54:04.936 --> 00:54:06.760
What amplifier do you use mainly?

00:54:07.121 --> 00:54:10.365
Well, I've been using a PB Special amp.

00:54:10.690 --> 00:54:12.913
130 for decades.

00:54:12.992 --> 00:54:14.876
That's for the clubs.

00:54:15.456 --> 00:54:18.742
But I have different amps I use in the studio sometimes.

00:54:18.782 --> 00:54:21.264
I got a Mesa Boogie Mark IV.

00:54:22.567 --> 00:54:35.326
And I recorded Roots and Branches with a rig similar to what Little Walter may have used.

00:54:35.650 --> 00:54:48.204
It's a throwback probably from the 40s or 50s, you know, with the two speakers that open up like a suitcase.

00:54:49.166 --> 00:54:56.114
And it's made by night, but I only use that for that session so far.

00:54:57.335 --> 00:54:59.018
And the PB one, is that your main amp?

00:54:59.159 --> 00:55:00.539
That's a tube amplifier?

00:55:01.320 --> 00:55:02.443
That's a

00:55:02.523 --> 00:55:02.922
solid

00:55:03.003 --> 00:55:03.324
state.

00:55:03.844 --> 00:55:05.246
That's a solid state, okay.

00:55:05.538 --> 00:55:07.380
Yeah, but it's really powerful.

00:55:07.780 --> 00:55:14.711
And, you know, on live shows, I don't necessarily go for the heavy distortion.

00:55:14.771 --> 00:55:25.228
It's a cleaner sound, but I got, you know, I don't necessarily, because of the style we play, I don't necessarily need that much distortion when we're playing live.

00:55:25.989 --> 00:55:27.972
Yeah, you've got that

00:55:27.992 --> 00:55:28.512
quiet, clean sound.

00:55:29.353 --> 00:55:31.498
Do you have any particular favorite small amp?

00:55:33.820 --> 00:55:34.061
No.

00:55:34.262 --> 00:55:34.302
No.

00:55:35.106 --> 00:55:42.175
I've run across various ones in the studio, but I'd be challenged to identify what they were.

00:55:43.615 --> 00:55:47.601
You mainly play, when you play with your band, you're using the big amps most of the time anyway, are you?

00:55:48.242 --> 00:55:48.422
Yeah.

00:55:49.382 --> 00:55:51.887
And microphones, any particular favorite microphones?

00:55:53.789 --> 00:56:04.442
I use Lecture Voice 630, 630A or 630, Lecture Voice 9.

00:56:05.634 --> 00:56:07.436
Is that a dynamic microphone?

00:56:08.179 --> 00:56:09.320
Yeah, it is.

00:56:09.902 --> 00:56:12.246
So it's a clean-sounding dynamic microphone, yeah.

00:56:12.567 --> 00:56:13.809
Yeah, Giles has told me that.

00:56:14.389 --> 00:56:23.987
He said when you were in Jersey, there wasn't an amp or something, and that you went through that microphone straight into the PA, maybe with one pedal.

00:56:24.168 --> 00:56:25.271
Did you have a pedal with it?

00:56:26.492 --> 00:56:28.918
Yeah, just a delay pedal.

00:56:29.601 --> 00:56:32.887
Yeah, he said you got a really tremendous sound, and he was keen to...

00:56:32.907 --> 00:56:34.009
Yeah.

00:56:34.670 --> 00:56:44.686
He was really blown away that you got this great sound just from going straight for the PA, and he was saying he was trying to, you know, he was looking up doing the same, because obviously the ease of just being able to play through the PA and not have to carry an amp and everything.

00:56:45.708 --> 00:56:45.969
Yeah, yeah,

00:56:46.048 --> 00:56:48.313
because we didn't have any amps.

00:56:49.054 --> 00:56:54.722
We didn't have an amp, so we tried that, and it really did sound good, you know.

00:56:55.324 --> 00:56:56.166
Yeah.

00:56:56.365 --> 00:56:56.445
It's...

00:56:56.769 --> 00:56:58.731
It's kind of luck of the draw what might happen.

00:56:58.771 --> 00:57:06.559
But that mic really just broke up just enough to get a nice sound there coming through the PA.

00:57:07.320 --> 00:57:13.445
So again, it's not quite a clean sound coming through the PA with a dynamic mic and a delay.

00:57:14.266 --> 00:57:15.188
Interesting.

00:57:16.489 --> 00:57:17.849
And do you use effects pedals?

00:57:18.431 --> 00:57:19.871
The delay pedal.

00:57:20.233 --> 00:57:23.155
Delay and an octave.

00:57:23.255 --> 00:57:25.918
But I have the octave up there.

00:57:26.114 --> 00:57:30.019
If the band's playing really loud, it gives me a little boost.

00:57:30.101 --> 00:57:32.023
And plus, I use it on certain solos.

00:57:33.005 --> 00:57:35.949
You can hear that on several recordings.

00:57:36.351 --> 00:57:38.855
People tell me, I knew that was you because I heard that octave.

00:57:39.376 --> 00:57:41.099
Any particular brand of octave pedal?

00:57:41.539 --> 00:57:44.244
I'm using Boss delay and octave.

00:57:45.025 --> 00:57:50.213
I think just to finish off then, if we obviously were in this COVID-19 pandemic at the moment, but...

00:57:50.722 --> 00:57:54.407
Beyond that, have you got any shows lined up later in the year?

00:57:54.487 --> 00:57:56.250
Are you hoping to get back out playing?

00:57:56.971 --> 00:57:59.014
Well, you know, we were scheduled.

00:57:59.173 --> 00:58:00.916
We would have been in China right now.

00:58:01.177 --> 00:58:02.759
We would have been in Wuhan

00:58:03.320 --> 00:58:03.940
right now.

00:58:05.143 --> 00:58:11.291
We had a three-week tour with my band, which, of course, was canceled or postponed.

00:58:11.371 --> 00:58:14.476
And Chicago Blues Fest, we have come up.

00:58:14.516 --> 00:58:18.240
We had Bellinzona Festival, King Biscuit Festival.

00:58:19.041 --> 00:58:23.106
Helen Arkansas, and Lou Cern.

00:58:23.807 --> 00:58:28.054
So we're just waiting to see what's going to happen, you know.

00:58:28.934 --> 00:58:34.061
And then hopefully we can get something to come back to the UK.

00:58:35.623 --> 00:58:42.273
I'm very pleased with Giles as a means for me to have a presence in the UK.

00:58:42.472 --> 00:58:44.635
For years, I hadn't played that much in the UK.

00:58:44.655 --> 00:58:49.021
And so in the last, I guess, four years now, Giles, I've been there probably for...

00:58:49.666 --> 00:58:51.248
almost half a dozen times.

00:58:51.989 --> 00:58:53.271
I've seen you play a few times here.

00:58:53.492 --> 00:58:58.659
Well, hopefully I'll get to meet you, Billy, at some point when you come up next across the UK or Europe.

00:58:58.798 --> 00:59:02.143
So, again, thanks very much for taking the time to talk to me.

00:59:02.164 --> 00:59:02.965
It's been a real pleasure.

00:59:03.005 --> 00:59:04.867
Yeah, thank you, Neil.

00:59:05.509 --> 00:59:06.811
That's it for today, folks.

00:59:07.172 --> 00:59:14.902
Final word from my sponsor, the Longwolf Blues Company, providing some great effects pedals and microphones, all purpose-built for the harmonica.

00:59:15.262 --> 00:59:16.746
Be sure to check out their website.

00:59:20.898 --> 00:59:21.693
Thank you.