May 3, 2023

Ed Hopwood interview

Ed Hopwood interview

Ed Hopwood joins me on episode 85. Ed is from the UK where he started out playing drums and he shares some tips on how to bring some rhythm into our harmonica playing. Ed loves early styles of harmonica and performs a range genres, including jug band, early blues, cajun, bluegrass and old-timey music. Ed has a one man band show where he plays harmonica, guitar, sings and a whole host of percussion instruments. He’s brought many of these skills to his main band, The Rigmarollers, a trio ...

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Season 1 Diatonic Harmonica Blues Harmonica Bluegrass Or Old Timey Pre-war Harmonica

Ed Hopwood joins me on episode 85.
Ed is from the UK where he started out playing drums and he shares some tips on how to bring some rhythm into our harmonica playing. 
Ed loves early styles of harmonica and performs a range genres, including jug band, early blues, cajun, bluegrass and old-timey music. Ed has a one man band show where he plays harmonica, guitar, sings and a whole host of percussion instruments. He’s brought many of these skills to his main band, The Rigmarollers, a trio who play a mixture of barrelhouse blues, ragtime, jazz, swing, gospel and infectious zydeco grooves.
As well as performing, Ed runs his harmonica tuition school, the Harmonica Barge, from the canal barge on which he lives in London. 

Links:

Ed’s website:
https://www.edhopwood.com/

The Rigmarollers band:
https://www.therigmarollers.com/

Teaching website:
https://www.theharmonicabarge.com/

Solo recordings on Soundcloud:
https://soundcloud.com/ed-hopwood-1

Mark Harrison albums:
https://www.markharrisonrootsmusic.com/music.php

Seth Shumate, old-time harmonica player:
https://oldtime-central.com/seth-shumate-oldtime-harmonica/


Videos:
One man band act:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RShyJrXbkFU

Rory McLeod, Love Like A Rock:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4gFDlm4oe0

Solo gig at The Green Note:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G7fmgikSS_A

Ed solo: Born In The Wrong Time:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n5gsMKfEpMs

Peter Madcat Ruth playing Nobody Knows You When You’re Down And Out:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L1UyPh3Z3LI

Harmonica Barge YouTube site:
https://www.youtube.com/@TheHarmonicaBarge

Cajun music interview with Ed:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8H8GEc2x0I

Country Blues lesson:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hdfucNQwEBM

Cindy, Old-time tune:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDfX9m830co

I Shall Not Be Moved, Gospel song:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=053CKZu-WOI



Podcast website:
https://www.harmonicahappyhour.com

Donations:
If you want to make a voluntary donation to help support the running costs of the podcast then please use this link (or visit the podcast website link above):
https://paypal.me/harmonicahappyhour?locale.x=en_GB

Spotify Playlist:
Also check out the Spotify Playlist, which contains most of the songs discussed in the podcast:
https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5QC6RF2VTfs4iPuasJBqwT?si=M-j3IkiISeefhR7ybm9qIQ

Podcast sponsors:
This podcast is sponsored by SEYDEL harmonicas - visit the oldest harmonica factory in the world at

Support the show

01:32 - Ed is from the UK, born in Derby

01:51 - First instrument was drums, inspired by father, who has worked as a professional drummer

02:23 - What influence did drummer father have on Ed’s music career and how Ed learnt music

03:14 - Started playing harmonica age 13, enjoying the portability compared to drums

03:43 - Early harmonica exposure from The Blues Collection magazine / CD series

04:29 - Started studying music seriously when attended music college in early 20s

04:36 - Studied carpentry before attending music school

04:57 - Isn’t using carpentry skills to make harmonica combs

05:29 - Ed lives on a canal barge, called Muddy Waters, from where he runs his harmonica tuition business: the Harmonica Barge

06:08 - Musical community living on the boat

06:30 - Runs a harmonica school called The Harmonica Barge

06:49 - Attended music college, first for popular music, then more focus on composition and song writing

08:50 - Played a little harmonica as part of the college course, with the portability becoming increasingly appealing

09:51 - One man band show is now making Ed having to carry more equipment again

10:14 - Tips on how to bring rhythm into your harmonica playing, from a drumming perspective

11:53 - Rhythmic repetitive licks are effective on harmonica

12:56 - Playing specific rhythms as part of harmonica playing, and implicit and explicit learning

14:49 - Other instruments Ed plays include: percussion, guitar, vocals, and one-man band show

16:45 - Tips for getting started as a one-man band include using your feet as the rhythm and strap a tambourine to your foot

17:51 - One of styles Ed plays is jug band music, and what makes up this genre of music

18:56 - Influences for Ed getting into pre-war styles

19:48 - Got interested in Bluegrass and old-timey music

20:02 - Had some lessons with Will Greener, who helped run the London Harps group

21:14 - Was a member of the Mark Harrison band, originally on drums, then on harmonica and backing vocals

22:58 - Drummers often have to play whatever kit is available

23:38 - Started out playing solo gigs

24:21 - The Rigmarollers band is Ed’s main focus now

24:42 - Hammond’s Place and Born In The Wrong time solo performance songs

26:56 - The Rigmarollers trio and first album: Mr Crump Don’t Like It

28:27 - Ed plays some kazoo and nose flute with The Rigmarollers

29:50 - Some of the songs from the Mr Crump Don’t Like It album

31:59 - Jed Davenport: early harmonica player

32:50 - Ed’s teaching on the Harmonica Barge and approach to teaching

36:04 - Different harmonica styles Ed teaches, starting with the fox chase

37:55 - Cajun harmonica and father played in a Cajun band

39:07 - Gospel harmonica and Elder Roma Wilson

41:39 - Old-timey music, based around playing tunes

43:25 - Teaches different styles to introduce people to the different genres it’s possible to play on harmonica

44:41 - What advantages playing tunes and melodically can bring to your harmonica playing

45:30 - Session work Ed has recorded

46:38 - Only plays diatonic harmonica, with plans to try some chromatic

47:17 - 10 minute question

47:45 - Practise routine

49:09 - Harmonica of choice is Hohner Marine Band, mostly Crossovers

49:21 - Does some harmonica maintenance himself and likes custom combs

49:55 - What maintenance Ed performs on the harps

51:09 - Doesn’t really use overblows

51:27 - Uses different positions, including 5th

52:39 - Different tunings and Powerbender

53:17 - Embouchre: started tongue blocking but uses the embouchre that suits the style of music

55:23 - Amp: Fishman Mini Loudbox for clean sound and Laney tube amp

55:51 - Blows Me Away Ultimate 58 mic and a Bulletini

56:29 - Effects: Harp Break and Octave pedal

56:59 - Hazmat Modine touring Europe summer of 2023

57:14 - Uses reverb from the amp and Boss pedal and delay pedal

57:53 - Future plans and new album out later this year

WEBVTT

00:00:00.194 --> 00:00:01.776
Ed Hopwood joins me on episode 85.

00:00:01.798 --> 00:00:09.353
Ed is from the UK where he started out playing drums and he shares some tips on how to bring some rhythm into our harmonica playing.

00:00:09.374 --> 00:00:18.193
Ed loves early styles of harmonica and performs a range of genres including jug band, early blues, cajun, bluegrass and old-timey music.

00:00:19.074 --> 00:00:24.621
Ed has a one-man band show where he plays harmonica, guitar, sings and a whole host of percussion instruments.

00:00:25.303 --> 00:00:35.558
He's brought many of these skills to his main band, the Rigmarolas, a trio who play a mixture of Barrowhouse blues, ragtime, jazz, swing, gospel and infectious Zydeco grooves.

00:00:36.240 --> 00:00:43.030
As well as performing, Ed runs his harmonica tuition school, the Harmonica Barge, from the Canal Barge on which he lives in London.

00:00:44.033 --> 00:00:46.557
This podcast is sponsored by Seidel Harmonicas.

00:00:46.978 --> 00:00:56.334
Visit the oldest harmonica factory in the world at www.seidel1847.com or on Facebook or Instagram at Seidel Harmonicas.

00:01:11.016 --> 00:01:11.358
Seidel Harmonicas

00:01:11.522 --> 00:01:26.045
Hello

00:01:26.165 --> 00:01:27.706
Ed Hopwood and welcome to the podcast.

00:01:28.489 --> 00:01:29.030
Hi Neil.

00:01:29.506 --> 00:01:29.766
Great.

00:01:29.825 --> 00:01:31.186
Thanks for joining me today.

00:01:31.268 --> 00:01:33.209
So you're based in the UK.

00:01:33.289 --> 00:01:35.730
I believe you grew up in Derby.

00:01:36.171 --> 00:01:37.013
Well, close.

00:01:37.153 --> 00:01:41.736
Yeah, I was actually born in Derby, but raised in Staffordshire, which is just across the river.

00:01:41.956 --> 00:01:43.237
So the river doves the border.

00:01:43.477 --> 00:01:47.522
I'm around 15 miles from Derby in a little town called Utoxeter.

00:01:47.682 --> 00:01:48.822
There's a race course there.

00:01:48.862 --> 00:01:50.504
That might be the only notable thing.

00:01:51.644 --> 00:01:55.087
You know, I believe your first instrument, you were playing drums at the age 10.

00:01:55.128 --> 00:01:56.248
Is that what got you into music?

00:01:56.448 --> 00:01:57.569
Yeah, pretty much.

00:01:57.891 --> 00:02:07.060
I mean, my dad still plays drums and was a pro drummer in the late sixties and seventies and still is still quite active on the music scene.

00:02:07.100 --> 00:02:08.722
So yeah, there was drums around the house.

00:02:09.122 --> 00:02:22.557
So myself and my brother both just kind of fell into it and I was playing at school and in a bunch of rock bands in my teens, some rock and metal bands, kind of heavier stuff than I'm into now, mostly.

00:02:23.042 --> 00:02:27.025
Yeah, but it's interesting that you say your father was a professional musician and still is.

00:02:27.086 --> 00:02:29.608
So how much of an influence do you think that was?

00:02:29.647 --> 00:02:31.969
And how much did he encourage you to take it up?

00:02:32.090 --> 00:02:34.792
Or was it just the availability, as you say, it was around the house?

00:02:34.812 --> 00:02:34.831
I

00:02:35.212 --> 00:02:36.473
think that was a big factor.

00:02:36.674 --> 00:02:44.820
And definitely just growing up with a lot of music around and he's got quite an extensive, well, he's downsized a bit, but he's got quite an extensive record collection.

00:02:44.961 --> 00:02:52.788
So we grew up listening to a lot of great music, a lot of jazz, a lot of blues, a lot of folk and world music, very varied tastes.

00:02:53.008 --> 00:02:56.775
He's actually quite a self-taught player with quite a distinct style.

00:02:56.914 --> 00:03:02.283
So he didn't really teach us as such, maybe showed us a few things here and there.

00:03:02.405 --> 00:03:07.092
But I didn't really have any drum tuition myself until I was in my early 20s.

00:03:07.193 --> 00:03:10.558
So mostly self-taught in my teens.

00:03:10.799 --> 00:03:14.425
And just, yeah, from listening to music and picking things up, being immersed in it.

00:03:14.689 --> 00:03:17.413
I understand you started playing harmonica about the age 13.

00:03:17.432 --> 00:03:17.693
Yeah,

00:03:18.354 --> 00:03:19.635
well, I took one into school.

00:03:19.855 --> 00:03:23.699
I think it was probably to annoy the teachers or the other kids.

00:03:24.260 --> 00:03:26.783
Made some bluesy sounds and enjoyed it.

00:03:27.024 --> 00:03:28.925
Didn't really play much, actually.

00:03:29.026 --> 00:03:29.667
It was all drums.

00:03:29.687 --> 00:03:39.437
And then I sort of picked the harp back up later and started jamming with people, realizing that, you know, you've got this thing which is tiny and it's far more mobile than a drum kit.

00:03:39.617 --> 00:03:43.401
So I recognized its appeal then for the portability, for sure.

00:03:43.441 --> 00:03:46.104
And were you listening to any harmonica music back then?

00:03:46.424 --> 00:03:49.026
Of course, but I definitely wasn't listening and copying.

00:03:49.346 --> 00:03:55.951
I used to get this thing called the Blues Collection, which was a series you get like, well, my dad had it, and then he'd sort of pass it on.

00:03:56.111 --> 00:04:01.037
And that was like a cassette tape accompanied by a magazine, which I think was like a monthly thing.

00:04:01.257 --> 00:04:05.439
So I had John Lee Hooker, Howlin' Wolf, like a lot of the chess record stuff.

00:04:05.580 --> 00:04:09.584
Yeah, I really enjoyed that kind of blues sound without thinking about it.

00:04:09.584 --> 00:04:13.508
or studying it, I just heard this sound and thought, yeah, that's really cool.

00:04:13.747 --> 00:04:17.872
And I was listening to a lot of swing records, big band kinds.

00:04:18.112 --> 00:04:19.475
That was for the drums, really.

00:04:19.754 --> 00:04:21.817
Stuff like Gene Krupa, Benny Goodman.

00:04:22.137 --> 00:04:23.619
So early jazz influences then?

00:04:23.918 --> 00:04:24.439
Yeah.

00:04:24.759 --> 00:04:29.786
Well, I was in my teens doing music a bit at school, but we had like one music lesson a week.

00:04:29.846 --> 00:04:33.009
There was no study going on really until I went to music college.

00:04:33.189 --> 00:04:34.990
I guess that was when I was 21, 22.

00:04:35.451 --> 00:04:39.475
So I'd actually left school and done a carpentry apprenticeship.

00:04:39.536 --> 00:04:41.697
not really knowing what I wanted to do at the time.

00:04:41.737 --> 00:04:47.545
So I'd sort of done my trade and then just out my apprenticeship and someone suggested going to music college.

00:04:47.845 --> 00:04:52.209
And I thought, oh yeah, that sounds like a good idea to put off work for a few more years.

00:04:52.230 --> 00:04:53.951
And

00:04:53.990 --> 00:04:55.533
you're still working as a musician now.

00:04:55.572 --> 00:04:57.274
So you're still succeeding on that front.

00:04:57.514 --> 00:04:57.935
Yeah.

00:04:57.995 --> 00:05:00.458
Well, it took a little while to give up the carpentry.

00:05:00.819 --> 00:05:03.701
Once people know you can do that, everyone's got a job for you.

00:05:04.062 --> 00:05:07.286
Now I can pretty much refuse and they know they're not going to get me now.

00:05:07.346 --> 00:05:07.906
So

00:05:07.946 --> 00:05:10.209
does that mean you're able to make harm monica combs

00:05:12.310 --> 00:05:25.223
that's something i haven't tried that that's probably quite intricate you know i can barely sand them flat at the moment which is harder than it looks getting into sort of tweaking tweaking my own harps making an entire comb i don't know maybe

00:05:26.045 --> 00:05:34.973
yeah that sounds like some transferable skills there for sure that you should look into but the other thing interesting might be connected to carpentry i don't know is that you you live on a uh on a canal barge

00:05:35.053 --> 00:05:36.295
yep Yes, indeed.

00:05:36.334 --> 00:05:38.016
She's called Muddy Waters.

00:05:38.577 --> 00:05:40.680
She's been a long restoration project.

00:05:41.081 --> 00:05:56.137
I was living on a big boat on the Thames, which was kind of slightly dilapidated and then ended up coming across this smaller project boat and fitted out the whole boat, myself restored it with the help of some other people as well.

00:05:56.798 --> 00:06:02.565
Yeah, I've done a lot of the woodwork in here out of recycled materials, which are pretty easy to come by in the city.

00:06:02.913 --> 00:06:07.620
So, you know, a lot of stuff gets thrown out in London, which is pretty, pretty decent materials.

00:06:08.081 --> 00:06:11.005
You find there's like a little musical community with the living on the boat.

00:06:11.507 --> 00:06:17.074
Yeah, where we were on the Thames before, that was a lot more of a community and quite a tight knit community of boats.

00:06:17.115 --> 00:06:20.740
So, yeah, there's some quite a few jams going on there around the fire.

00:06:20.781 --> 00:06:22.062
Some nice parties.

00:06:22.343 --> 00:06:24.225
We even had a festival on the boat.

00:06:24.545 --> 00:06:27.408
A full weekend festival, which we called Folk for Sale.

00:06:27.608 --> 00:06:28.951
No one fell in, luckily.

00:06:28.990 --> 00:06:33.536
So you have a harmonica school called the Harmonica Barge, isn't it?

00:06:33.576 --> 00:06:34.877
Which we'll get onto later.

00:06:34.918 --> 00:06:37.321
So we got the connection there to the Harmonica Barge.

00:06:38.021 --> 00:06:43.668
In the house.

00:06:43.687 --> 00:06:44.348
In the house.

00:06:47.291 --> 00:06:49.053
In the house.

00:06:49.538 --> 00:06:52.761
So you say you went to music college.

00:06:52.821 --> 00:06:59.848
I think you studied a kind of folk, traditional type subject on your music course.

00:06:59.869 --> 00:07:00.329
Is that right?

00:07:00.930 --> 00:07:09.579
Well, actually, the first course at college was what they call a popular music diploma, which is pretty general, as opposed to classical.

00:07:09.639 --> 00:07:14.363
So, you know, it's not classical, but that encompassed quite a lot of different styles.

00:07:14.963 --> 00:07:16.466
And again, I was mostly drumming then.

00:07:16.737 --> 00:07:18.521
with a little bit of harmonica.

00:07:18.961 --> 00:07:22.548
You'd work on a lot of different styles, a lot of copying.

00:07:22.629 --> 00:07:24.892
So I'd say not too creative.

00:07:25.233 --> 00:07:30.504
And that's one thing I find with a lot of the college courses and especially the pop music courses.

00:07:30.524 --> 00:07:52.254
So a lot of it's kind of teaching you how to copy other people And actually, it wasn't until I started my degree, so I moved down to London to do a popular music degree, that we got into more composition and songwriting in the second year and trying to be a bit more creative, which is definitely something where I feel that's where I'm at at the moment in terms of harmonica and songwriting.

00:07:52.353 --> 00:07:53.875
Yeah, it was a great course.

00:07:54.096 --> 00:08:00.627
I mean, we had rhythm and blues studies, which was also like classic 50s and 60s R&B.

00:08:00.947 --> 00:08:12.185
And you'd basically study a song, you'd study the drummer and the style, and then you'd meet up on a Friday and you'd form bands with the students from the other schools.

00:08:12.286 --> 00:08:14.569
So there'd be a lot of guitarists, bass players, vocalists.

00:08:15.041 --> 00:08:19.910
And you'd get together and form a band, no rehearsal, and then do the song you'd been working on.

00:08:19.970 --> 00:08:21.172
So that was a weekly thing.

00:08:21.713 --> 00:08:24.658
And so you say you were specialising in drums on this course.

00:08:25.199 --> 00:08:25.939
Yeah, that's right.

00:08:26.201 --> 00:08:28.564
The second year we did quite a lot of jazz.

00:08:29.045 --> 00:08:31.649
So I took jazz as a specialist playing style.

00:08:32.001 --> 00:08:37.145
And the third year was a sort of final project, which I actually did blues for my final project.

00:08:37.267 --> 00:08:42.951
So I formed a band, composed a whole bunch of material, and then went and played a gig.

00:08:43.231 --> 00:08:46.455
And then we recorded that material as well and made a CD.

00:08:46.995 --> 00:08:49.557
A bit of business, the business side of

00:08:49.636 --> 00:08:49.716
it.

00:08:50.057 --> 00:08:53.139
So did you bring any harmonica playing into the course or did that come afterwards?

00:08:53.801 --> 00:08:56.423
So there's a little bit in my composition, actually.

00:08:56.562 --> 00:08:58.845
So yeah, we did country and blues.

00:08:58.924 --> 00:09:02.369
And when I recorded in the composition, yeah, I definitely played a bit of up then.

00:09:02.408 --> 00:09:11.961
And it was really just towards the end, really the third year where I was getting more and more into harmonica and especially being in the city, you know, drums was always hard to practice.

00:09:12.520 --> 00:09:14.043
There's a lot of barriers with drums.

00:09:14.143 --> 00:09:21.293
So, you know, not being able to play whenever you like and obviously the transportation, whereas harmonica, there's not so many barriers.

00:09:21.753 --> 00:09:28.341
Obviously you've got to put the time in like any other instrument, but at least it's like, you know, you can play whenever you want

00:09:28.642 --> 00:09:35.150
and You've definitely gone from one extreme to the other, you know, the big, heavy to pack, a set up, put away, drums, clearly really annoyed you.

00:09:35.171 --> 00:09:38.374
I thought I need the most portable instrument there is to oppose that.

00:09:38.413 --> 00:09:38.794
Was that it?

00:09:39.816 --> 00:09:40.816
Yeah, absolutely.

00:09:40.836 --> 00:09:43.339
I think as well, I was doing carpentry at the time.

00:09:43.379 --> 00:09:48.383
So that was like a car full of tools and then, you know, drums and hardware and everything else.

00:09:48.423 --> 00:09:50.804
So yeah, a lifetime of carrying stuff around.

00:09:51.184 --> 00:09:52.807
Now I've got a one man band show.

00:09:52.886 --> 00:09:57.110
So that's, you know, I'm actually building up a lot, too much gear probably again.

00:09:57.230 --> 00:09:58.392
And I play percussion.

00:09:58.731 --> 00:09:59.673
I've incorporated that.

00:09:59.953 --> 00:10:06.023
But yeah, the gigs where you just turn up with a small case of harmonicas, that's a wonderful thing to cherish.

00:10:06.563 --> 00:10:06.764
Yeah.

00:10:06.884 --> 00:10:14.255
So just on the drums, and I'm sure you're asked this question a lot between what you learned from the drums for the harmonica.

00:10:14.296 --> 00:10:20.065
So maybe what tips would you give people to bring some more rhythm into the harmonica playing?

00:10:20.625 --> 00:10:24.331
Thinking rhythmically involves a slightly different mindset.

00:10:24.812 --> 00:10:30.703
As a melodic instrument, be it harmonica or guitar, obviously having that opportunity to play melodies.

00:10:31.225 --> 00:10:42.681
You're thinking more about licks and the way a melody's moving or maybe playing a lot of notes and obviously trying to, we all like playing flashy licks or intricate licks.

00:10:43.121 --> 00:10:46.506
It sounds super cool, but rhythm is a different approach.

00:10:46.807 --> 00:11:01.091
If you're thinking like a drummer, then that's really about consistency because groove's built on something being regular Having something which people can latch onto, so that's that repetitive nature, that's a slightly different skill.

00:11:01.152 --> 00:11:14.653
And if you haven't worked on that, trying to be consistent and repetitive in what you do, it can be quite a challenge trying to provide that rhythmic nuance for the groove, which obviously is so important in blues music.

00:11:15.014 --> 00:11:15.134
Mm-hmm.

00:11:15.234 --> 00:11:25.337
and jazz and a lot of folk, but especially blues, because I think the thing that really appeals about a blues groove is its simplicity and its feel.

00:11:25.778 --> 00:11:32.413
And you should be tapping your foot or nodding your head if you're in the audience, even without thinking about it.

00:11:47.586 --> 00:11:52.445
you can get a bit of that into your harmonica playing, I think that's the way to go.

00:11:52.961 --> 00:11:56.365
Yeah, and I think some of the most effective harmonica is often that, isn't it?

00:11:56.384 --> 00:12:01.929
It's often those kind of repetitive licks, you know, that really sort of drives it, and it's simple and repetitive.

00:12:02.169 --> 00:12:05.092
Is that something that you try and approach the harmonica to play like?

00:12:05.572 --> 00:12:06.553
Yeah, definitely.

00:12:06.594 --> 00:12:27.748
And I think coming from a strong bass, so if you want to work on getting a more rhythmic approach into your playing, like more chords and mixing melodies with the chords, which is something I really like to do, you know, I've been influenced quite a lot by old-timey melodies and Cajun and Zydeco melodies, but then having the chord as a strong bass.

00:12:27.888 --> 00:12:29.389
I mean, there's different ways to approach that.

00:12:29.429 --> 00:12:34.933
Sometimes you can start with the melody and then start to substitute some of that melody for chords.

00:12:35.034 --> 00:12:36.416
And that's a good way to do it.

00:12:36.676 --> 00:12:51.087
But also, if you think of a groove like the Fox Chase or what we'd call sort of the classic country blues rhythm, which are very similar in some ways, they're often from having that rhythmic bass as the foundation and then building melody on top of that.

00:12:51.389 --> 00:12:56.595
That can be a tricky thing for people at first to get into this different style of playing.

00:12:57.155 --> 00:13:01.724
What about when you're playing more melodic single note things?

00:13:01.823 --> 00:13:07.514
Are you thinking about I'm playing triplets and I'm playing across the beat and I'm playing across the bar?

00:13:07.774 --> 00:13:11.341
Are you thinking in that way from a drummer's perspective as well?

00:13:11.722 --> 00:13:30.629
I would describe that as thinking about rhythm explicitly in a way that if you have these two styles of learning, explicit and implicit, which you hear banded around quite a lot, but I think it's a great analogy because if you've listened to a lot of blues and a lot of folk music, you'd probably be doing these things anyway without realizing it.

00:13:30.710 --> 00:13:36.638
You'd be putting in triplets and mixing the subdivisions and crossing the bar line or doing metric modulation.

00:13:37.097 --> 00:13:54.418
But of course, when you study something explicitly, then you can name those things and that might help you to be more aware I don't necessarily think one approach is better than the other and perhaps the implicit way has more benefits in certain respects.

00:13:54.879 --> 00:14:03.761
But yeah, having more awareness of rhythmic skills and then being able to utilize them and try them over different styles, I think that's pretty useful.

00:14:04.033 --> 00:14:12.345
The danger of that is, of course, you could get too sophisticated and put in rhythmic things which sound a bit contrived.

00:14:12.424 --> 00:14:14.788
But it really depends on the style of music you're playing.

00:14:15.028 --> 00:14:21.357
I guess with a lot of these things, it's trying to make it sound like you're doing it seamlessly.

00:14:21.378 --> 00:14:24.140
And that's where practice comes in.

00:14:24.181 --> 00:14:33.053
And in a way, you could practice a rhythm and be really trying to work on different subdivisions, for example, or playing across the ball line with something that sounds quite fancy.

00:14:33.474 --> 00:14:36.844
then you want that to then become an implicit part of your playing.

00:14:37.184 --> 00:14:40.735
So it sounds like you're not thinking about it when you're actually performing.

00:14:40.875 --> 00:14:44.407
And I guess you shouldn't be thinking about it when you're performing as well.

00:14:44.647 --> 00:14:48.018
Although we're starting to get these things are kind of quite hard to define.

00:14:48.354 --> 00:14:48.894
Yeah.

00:14:49.394 --> 00:14:54.341
I mean, so other instruments you're playing, I saw you play in February and really enjoyed the show.

00:14:54.422 --> 00:14:55.344
It was fantastic.

00:14:55.504 --> 00:14:56.365
Oh, great.

00:14:56.785 --> 00:15:05.957
So in that you're playing percussion, you're playing a washboard, you kind of got your bells and whistles and you're also singing, you're playing guitar, playing harmonic on a rack when you're doing that.

00:15:05.998 --> 00:15:11.645
So you definitely, as you mentioned earlier, taking on the multi-instrumental approach now, yeah?

00:15:12.001 --> 00:15:13.244
Yeah, absolutely.

00:15:13.264 --> 00:15:19.490
Well, I was playing some gigs with guitar and then I sort of found just adding to the sound is quite nice with the feet.

00:15:19.551 --> 00:15:22.674
And obviously with the drum, the drum training, that comes naturally to me.

00:15:39.134 --> 00:15:41.418
So the one man band show, I've got a suitcase.

00:15:41.730 --> 00:15:43.614
with a drum skin cut into it.

00:15:43.634 --> 00:15:46.639
It's basically a 70s Samsonite suitcase.

00:15:47.240 --> 00:15:47.923
I sit on that.

00:15:48.143 --> 00:15:50.849
Well, if I'm not standing up, depending on the gig.

00:15:51.230 --> 00:15:52.331
So that's with the right foot.

00:15:52.371 --> 00:15:53.955
And then I've got a tambourine with the left.

00:15:54.336 --> 00:15:57.663
I sometimes use a service bell with the feet as well.

00:15:57.702 --> 00:15:59.807
I saw a jug band doing that somewhere.

00:16:00.148 --> 00:16:01.230
And then guitar and harp.

00:16:01.250 --> 00:16:03.134
So yeah, there's quite a bit of multitasking.

00:16:03.234 --> 00:16:24.408
going on and that sort of bled over into the into the band as well so with the rigmarole as i'll use the i'll use the suitcase and the feet percussion and then switch it up and play washboard sometimes so i've been i enjoy the washboard and more recently i've been using a stand-up snare drum with cowbell and woodblock so it keeps expanding really yeah

00:16:24.489 --> 00:16:29.658
so those percussions uh you see these guys playing percussion so many little toys pulled out the bag isn't it's incredible

00:16:29.857 --> 00:16:31.427
Well, I have a suitcase full.

00:16:31.708 --> 00:16:34.023
Yeah, I'm collecting more all the time.

00:16:34.102 --> 00:16:36.437
But that's, yeah, a bit of novelty at a gig.

00:16:36.802 --> 00:16:40.486
With the jug band style and old blues, I think that stuff goes down

00:16:40.586 --> 00:16:41.087
quite well.

00:16:41.589 --> 00:16:43.331
Oh, it's very entertaining, definitely.

00:16:43.451 --> 00:16:43.812
Oh, thanks.

00:16:44.011 --> 00:16:49.340
So, I mean, clearly your drumming background has helped you be able to do this, to play the drums.

00:16:49.360 --> 00:16:50.741
Like you say, you've got a suitcase drum.

00:16:51.123 --> 00:16:58.113
So you'd say people need a good basis to be able to take this on, or is it something you could do at a basic level, do you think, without too much training?

00:16:58.854 --> 00:16:59.815
Yeah, I think so.

00:16:59.916 --> 00:17:00.836
A start would be...

00:17:01.730 --> 00:17:09.941
I'm sure not everyone wants to become a one-man band, but actually getting the feet going, and I'll often work on this with my students, it's almost like walking.

00:17:10.221 --> 00:17:24.279
If you can get a right, left, right, left with the feet, and the right's doing one and three, and the left's doing two and four, doing something that simple can not only help your groove, it's going to build your internal sense of rhythm.

00:17:24.299 --> 00:17:29.046
And if you wanted to play solo, you'd have an accompaniment there straight away.

00:17:29.473 --> 00:17:33.257
strap a tambourine on your left foot, and then you've got something doing the two and four.

00:17:33.577 --> 00:17:36.059
So there's quite a lot of nice amount of solo.

00:17:36.099 --> 00:17:42.605
So if you wanted to do blues repertoire, you could accompany yourself with the feet and strengthen the groove at the same time.

00:17:42.625 --> 00:17:44.787
So yeah, I'd really recommend that as an approach.

00:17:45.228 --> 00:17:50.652
And clearly this matches very well to the jug band style, which is something that you play.

00:17:50.731 --> 00:17:57.357
So talking about some of the different styles you do play, clearly jug band, which we define as kind of 1920s, 1930s.

00:17:57.377 --> 00:17:59.700
Would you sort of describe it as a kind of early blues form Yeah,

00:18:00.422 --> 00:18:04.890
although, I mean, you could obviously you can argue about these things, the origins as people do.

00:18:05.190 --> 00:18:07.914
You could say it's a bit more based on trad jazz.

00:18:08.296 --> 00:18:11.741
A lot of the musicians were playing jazz and then sort of formed a skiffle.

00:18:11.801 --> 00:18:15.709
But of course, there's the strong elements of blues in there as well.

00:18:16.309 --> 00:18:20.857
And especially, especially sort of Piedmont blues and East Coast stuff and ragtime.

00:18:21.089 --> 00:18:24.174
So there's a lot of fusion there, ragtime chord progressions.

00:18:24.234 --> 00:18:34.292
Obviously, ragtime's a big part of that East Coast blues because they were exposed to those sort of more varied styles than, say, in the Mississippi.

00:18:34.373 --> 00:18:37.157
So there's a big element of that that comes into

00:18:37.218 --> 00:18:41.705
jog band.

00:18:41.726 --> 00:18:41.885
Jog band.

00:18:46.817 --> 00:18:49.820
Right, and so you play other styles as well, which we'll get into.

00:18:49.861 --> 00:18:52.522
You're playing old-timey, bluegrass, sadical.

00:18:52.663 --> 00:18:57.887
We'll get into that in a second, but just talking a little bit about what influenced you then on the harmonica.

00:18:57.928 --> 00:19:02.892
Was it the jug band players that really got you interested in learning to play the harmonica more?

00:19:03.412 --> 00:19:11.640
Actually, I think probably the first sort of notable harp recording, there's a guy called Rory McLeod, a great harp player I'm sure you've heard of.

00:19:12.039 --> 00:19:12.559
He's been on the

00:19:12.599 --> 00:19:13.340
podcast, yeah.

00:19:14.842 --> 00:19:15.202
Oh, right.

00:19:15.303 --> 00:19:15.883
Oh, fantastic.

00:19:16.042 --> 00:19:16.784
I must listen to that one.

00:19:16.784 --> 00:19:17.724
Okay, I missed that.

00:19:18.046 --> 00:19:20.650
I heard a track of his called Love Like a Rock.

00:19:33.808 --> 00:19:36.772
I'd never heard the harmonica played in that way before.

00:19:36.894 --> 00:19:41.079
So I heard that recording and that, yeah, that just really opened up that, wow.

00:19:41.440 --> 00:19:47.511
Then listening to quite a lot of blues players like Howlin' Wolf, and sort of jamming the blues a lot.

00:19:47.833 --> 00:19:53.419
And then I got into bluegrass and old-timey music and just started taking to a harmonica to those jams.

00:19:53.898 --> 00:20:01.807
I was playing guitar a lot when I got into bluegrass, probably sort of like eight or ten years ago, and then took my harp with me to jams.

00:20:02.288 --> 00:20:09.998
You know, I read somewhere that you had a few lessons with a few people in London there, one of which is Will Greener, who was a really good player.

00:20:10.038 --> 00:20:10.678
Oh, yeah.

00:20:10.718 --> 00:20:12.400
Will was a massive influence.

00:20:12.460 --> 00:20:20.082
Well, actually, he was running a group which I started going to called London Harps, which was a bunch of harmonica players who'd meet up.

00:20:20.402 --> 00:20:23.405
And it was a very sort of low cost grassroots affair.

00:20:23.465 --> 00:20:24.968
We'd meet up and share ideas.

00:20:25.269 --> 00:20:27.652
And he started being the main workshop leader there.

00:20:27.751 --> 00:20:29.114
So I learned a lot from him.

00:20:29.153 --> 00:20:34.601
And then I actually ended up, I joined a band, the Mark Harrison band, where he was playing harp and I was playing drums.

00:20:40.950 --> 00:20:40.990
Oh,

00:20:45.665 --> 00:20:51.894
I

00:20:52.035 --> 00:20:58.244
ended up doing four albums with Mark and two of those were with Will and a lot of gigs.

00:20:59.046 --> 00:21:01.449
So I got to listen to his playing a lot.

00:21:01.930 --> 00:21:05.394
I still rate him as one of the finest harmonica players around.

00:21:05.935 --> 00:21:10.082
Some of the recordings on his early albums are really, really phenomenal playing.

00:21:10.442 --> 00:21:12.526
He was a great mentor and taught me a lot.

00:21:12.897 --> 00:21:15.780
So as you say there, you were playing with Mark Harrison.

00:21:15.820 --> 00:21:18.462
Was that one of your, well, it sounds like you played in a few bands.

00:21:18.482 --> 00:21:20.163
Was that the first band you played harmonica with?

00:21:20.744 --> 00:21:23.586
Yes, apart from sort of occasional jamming.

00:21:23.626 --> 00:21:29.531
So when Will left the band, I started playing a bit of harp at the same time as playing drums.

00:21:29.972 --> 00:21:32.654
And that actually coincided for the last album.

00:21:32.734 --> 00:21:34.717
I was sort of getting out of drums and doing that.

00:21:34.757 --> 00:21:36.038
I'd started the one man band.

00:21:36.137 --> 00:21:40.801
So I was playing more harp and then went to just on the last album I did with Mark.

00:21:40.961 --> 00:21:41.923
And that would have been 2018.

00:21:42.864 --> 00:21:50.431
18, I think, then I just played harp and sang backing vocals on that, following in Will's footsteps, which wasn't easy.

00:22:06.686 --> 00:22:08.990
So you recorded four albums, as you say, with Mark Harrison.

00:22:09.665 --> 00:22:13.971
So on drums, the first two on drums, I think, were you playing harmonica on the last two albums?

00:22:14.071 --> 00:22:16.015
Were you playing drums as well on those two albums?

00:22:16.776 --> 00:22:19.900
Yeah, well, actually drums on the penultimate album.

00:22:20.141 --> 00:22:27.230
Then he actually, he got another drummer in for the last album and I just ended up doing harp and vocals on that one.

00:22:27.550 --> 00:22:28.752
Yeah, the panoramic view.

00:22:32.557 --> 00:22:32.637
Yeah.

00:22:45.506 --> 00:22:51.068
It was a great time playing with Mark and we did lots of festivals and some nice gigs.

00:22:51.590 --> 00:22:54.382
For sure, yeah, Will was a really tremendous player.

00:22:54.983 --> 00:22:56.230
A militant tongue blocker.

00:22:56.642 --> 00:23:00.345
Were you playing a full drum kit with this band?

00:23:00.786 --> 00:23:07.030
Well, yeah, my full drum kit is sort of stripped down to be a kick, snare, hi-hats, and then a bit of percussion.

00:23:07.191 --> 00:23:10.854
You know, as a drummer, you're often left to whatever's in the venue, really.

00:23:10.953 --> 00:23:13.696
So poor drummers get a rough deal, I think.

00:23:14.637 --> 00:23:17.059
You can't always take your kit to a festival.

00:23:17.119 --> 00:23:18.740
So often you just use what's there.

00:23:18.780 --> 00:23:25.406
And I frequently used to find that often like toms were so out of tune that it was just easier not to use them.

00:23:25.547 --> 00:23:37.380
And I think for a lot of blues and roots you know it's kind of stripped down drumming approach as well so I'd play quite simply on the drums so I didn't really need an Iron Maiden sized kit to play with him.

00:23:37.900 --> 00:23:45.788
Yeah great so it was before this then that you started playing solo and is that how you started performing you were doing solo stuff first were you?

00:23:46.148 --> 00:23:57.823
For the one man band yeah so I actually had a support show for Mark at the Green Note Cafe which is a nice little venue in Camden Town North London I think it was my first proper gig as a one-man band.

00:24:13.506 --> 00:24:25.636
since then i've played at quite a lot of unexpected places various festivals and a fair few venues around london sort of takes a back seat now with the rigmarolas my trio being the main focus

00:24:25.997 --> 00:24:26.156
yeah

00:24:26.356 --> 00:24:41.450
so you know sometimes i said i tend to i bought gigs for the rigmarolas as the main focus but you know sometimes a venue will want to just a solo artist or depend on budget so i'll i'll do solo gigs as well so it depends on the occasion really

00:24:41.871 --> 00:24:48.721
sure yeah and so picking out some of the songs you do as a solo artist so there's a song called hammond's place which has got some nice low rhythmic

00:24:48.780 --> 00:25:02.526
harmonica in there and

00:25:04.834 --> 00:25:05.875
where's this song come from

00:25:06.255 --> 00:25:48.422
it was quite old timey influence definitely at a time when I was listening to a lot of old time music and that was inspired actually by my local local butchers and deli when I was living I was living on the old boat and it was the boat was sinking slowly I should add but the tide would come in so we'd have to pump the water out the boats when the tide was in and then the tide would go out it was never too dramatic unless it was winter but I would I'd walk down the deli in the mornings to get a visions and i came up with that tune as i was i'd walk down the deli and just play my harp along the riverside and that's that tune just emerged at that time yeah so i recorded that one's on my ep and uh yeah i still play it now

00:25:48.663 --> 00:26:11.023
good one another one i picked out from your solo is um born in the wrong time so This is where you're playing guitar and harmonica and a rack and singing.

00:26:11.084 --> 00:26:14.675
So is this linked to your love of the older music?

00:26:14.715 --> 00:26:15.577
Yeah,

00:26:16.842 --> 00:26:17.664
I'd say a little bit.

00:26:17.684 --> 00:26:20.092
That one's sort of semi-autobiographical.

00:26:22.049 --> 00:26:52.896
and uh the the song's based on there's an idea of a i believe they call it generational dysphoria where where some people think that they could be born in a completely different time so i did read this on the internet so it might not be true but you know you'll come across say someone will think they they should have been born as a medieval witch in the 17th century and uh you know people really believed this and i thought actually you know maybe maybe there's a little bit of that in more people than we think we associate themselves with uh with another time.

00:26:53.277 --> 00:26:54.739
So yeah, that's where that came from.

00:26:55.299 --> 00:26:55.579
Great.

00:26:55.599 --> 00:26:55.839
Yeah.

00:26:55.880 --> 00:27:01.105
So your current band now is the Rigmarollers, which you've released so far one album with.

00:27:01.185 --> 00:27:05.369
So what's the lineup with this and what sort of music you're playing with these guys?

00:27:05.730 --> 00:27:06.090
Yeah.

00:27:06.131 --> 00:27:11.396
So the Rigmarollers actually started as a duo with myself and Julian Marshall.

00:27:11.717 --> 00:27:14.640
We were playing in an old time string band for a while.

00:27:14.720 --> 00:27:17.042
So we were quite into the old time Appalachian stuff.

00:27:17.363 --> 00:27:25.372
And then we got into, well, Julian's especially got more into into Ragtime music, and obviously I've always been into blues.

00:27:25.791 --> 00:27:35.363
So we formed the duo The Rigmarolders and we were playing quite a few shows and we were busking quite a lot down by the river, down by the Thames, which was always nice.

00:27:35.403 --> 00:27:38.885
And then we got joined by our friend Ewan on the sousaphone.

00:27:39.227 --> 00:27:43.270
So then it sort of went up a notch with the sousaphone and the trio was formed.

00:27:43.751 --> 00:27:46.734
And yeah, we recorded our first album, Mr.

00:27:46.795 --> 00:27:47.576
Crump Don't Like It.

00:27:47.596 --> 00:27:49.397
That was 2020.

00:27:49.730 --> 00:27:52.174
which has been pretty well received since.

00:27:52.315 --> 00:27:55.843
And we're currently working on our new album.

00:27:55.903 --> 00:27:59.871
So we're sousaphone, washboard, obviously suitcase drum.

00:28:00.353 --> 00:28:03.578
Julian was playing a resonator acoustic guitar, although he's just gone.

00:28:03.720 --> 00:28:07.106
He's just turned into a traitor and gone electric recently.

00:28:07.126 --> 00:28:10.493
And I play harmonica and sing harmonica.

00:28:10.690 --> 00:28:13.653
So yeah, there's a few instruments going on between us.

00:28:14.234 --> 00:28:16.478
Julian can also play fiddle and mandolin.

00:28:16.498 --> 00:28:23.968
So there's some fiddle and mandolin on the first album, although recently he's playing a lot more guitar and I'm sticking on the harmonica.

00:28:24.028 --> 00:28:26.009
So that's kind of where we're going at the moment

00:28:26.049 --> 00:28:26.391
with that.

00:28:27.051 --> 00:28:36.344
Another feature of this band is that you play kazoo.

00:28:40.569 --> 00:28:40.670
Kazoo.

00:28:42.465 --> 00:28:48.115
Yeah, you know, people love it or hate it, but the kazoo finds its way in.

00:28:48.134 --> 00:28:49.277
So it's quite a jug band thing.

00:28:49.656 --> 00:28:52.903
And nose flute may also get an outing.

00:28:53.343 --> 00:28:55.385
It's another love or hate instrument.

00:28:55.426 --> 00:28:57.390
They're very divisive instruments.

00:29:01.135 --> 00:29:01.977
There's the nose flute.

00:29:02.557 --> 00:29:04.059
Sounds better in a band context.

00:29:04.180 --> 00:29:05.021
You'll have to believe me.

00:29:05.346 --> 00:29:09.031
Just picking out a few songs on this Mr.

00:29:09.051 --> 00:29:10.073
Crump Don't Like It album.

00:29:10.374 --> 00:29:10.974
So Mr.

00:29:10.994 --> 00:29:17.183
Crump Don't Like It is actually a song that I performed in two bands myself, a fantastic song about the prohibition in America, so it works really well.

00:29:17.284 --> 00:29:20.308
And on this, there's a good demo of you doing your bells and whistles.

00:29:21.250 --> 00:29:21.290
Mr.

00:29:28.080 --> 00:29:33.950
Crump Don't Like It

00:29:42.690 --> 00:29:44.193
Yeah, it's a great song, that one.

00:29:45.036 --> 00:29:46.538
I didn't realise anyone else did it.

00:29:46.779 --> 00:29:47.320
That's cool.

00:29:47.882 --> 00:29:55.058
And then a song I saw you perform live, which I really loved and I've since discovered is a Fats Waller song, is When Somebody Thinks You're Wonderful.

00:29:55.200 --> 00:29:57.885
And you sing that very nicely, I think.

00:29:58.018 --> 00:30:06.767
Oh, when somebody thinks you're wonderful, what a difference in your day.

00:30:08.869 --> 00:30:13.934
Seems as though your troubles disappear, all

00:30:13.954 --> 00:30:15.416
like a feather

00:30:15.436 --> 00:30:15.817
in your...

00:30:15.836 --> 00:30:17.137
That's a lovely song to play.

00:30:17.159 --> 00:30:19.981
It's a great old ballad, always goes down well.

00:30:20.541 --> 00:30:22.825
And yeah, I really enjoy singing that song.

00:30:22.845 --> 00:30:27.750
That was one of those which, I don't know why we started playing that, actually.

00:30:28.193 --> 00:30:30.557
Yeah, it always goes down well at gigs.

00:30:30.637 --> 00:30:32.921
So yeah, we thought we'd put that one on the album.

00:30:33.320 --> 00:30:35.044
Yeah, and then Nobody Knows You When You're Down

00:30:35.104 --> 00:30:35.464
and Out.

00:30:35.484 --> 00:30:55.473
I don't know, is that originally a Nina Simone song?

00:30:56.130 --> 00:30:57.114
Oh, I don't know.

00:30:57.134 --> 00:30:59.342
It's not originally Eric Clapton.

00:30:59.402 --> 00:31:00.023
I know that much.

00:31:01.128 --> 00:31:03.036
Even though I think he still owns the rights to it.

00:31:03.758 --> 00:31:06.749
I think Bessie Smith did a notable version of that.

00:31:07.041 --> 00:31:07.382
Right.

00:31:07.702 --> 00:31:13.390
Although actually the version on the record was actually inspired by a video I saw of Peter Madcap Ruth.

00:31:13.569 --> 00:31:13.851
Oh, yeah.

00:31:14.151 --> 00:31:18.115
Who does a great solo version with guitar and harp.

00:31:18.175 --> 00:31:20.920
So it was actually inspired by his version.

00:31:24.324 --> 00:31:28.670
Yeah.

00:31:37.185 --> 00:31:59.718
And then finally on this album, I've got you a little clip of you playing Save Me Some.

00:31:59.739 --> 00:32:03.284
It's a Jed Davenport song for anyone who hasn't heard him.

00:32:03.364 --> 00:32:04.786
He's an incredible player.

00:32:05.026 --> 00:32:12.530
I think there might have been a time where I tried to work out a bit of what he was doing, but then realized, like I do with a lot of these old players.

00:32:12.931 --> 00:32:16.455
Part laziness and part wanting to be a bit more creative.

00:32:17.217 --> 00:32:22.284
I listen to a bit and then sort of go about it my own way and play it in my own style.

00:32:22.463 --> 00:32:29.794
But his style's very idiosyncratic and he's doing these growls and the phrasing is just incredible.

00:32:30.174 --> 00:32:33.858
I really, really recommend him as a player to listen to.

00:32:33.898 --> 00:32:41.769
He's really, really something special.

00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:00.000
...

00:32:42.082 --> 00:32:52.592
So we'll move on then to talking about your teaching.

00:32:52.612 --> 00:32:54.094
You've touched on it a few times.

00:32:55.194 --> 00:33:05.505
As we say, you live on a barge on the river or canal there, and you call your harmonica school the Harmonica Barge, and that's the website, and I'll put a link onto that in the podcast page.

00:33:06.125 --> 00:33:15.098
And touching on, as we talked about your harmonica education earlier on, I believe you sort of did some sort of focus on music education.

00:33:15.159 --> 00:33:17.721
So how have you applied that to your harmonica teaching?

00:33:18.301 --> 00:33:22.787
Yeah, I mean, we did quite a bit of teaching even at college as part of the diploma.

00:33:22.826 --> 00:33:28.213
So we were actually assigned another student to go and do some one-on-one teaching with.

00:33:28.493 --> 00:33:32.238
I taught guitarist drums and then he taught me guitar.

00:33:32.298 --> 00:33:37.364
So there was lesson exchanges and then we'd sort of review and evaluate and have some tuition.

00:33:37.604 --> 00:33:38.545
So that was good.

00:33:38.586 --> 00:33:49.375
And then For part of my degree, we actually went into schools and we did a bunch of teaching in schools as work experience, even though a lot of that was percussion at the time.

00:33:49.737 --> 00:33:51.599
That was a very interesting experience.

00:33:51.839 --> 00:34:04.061
I've been teaching really ever since I was at college, so for almost 20 years now, starting with drums, moving on to more harmonica and guitar and some ukulele.

00:34:04.385 --> 00:34:06.748
and percussion and singing as well.

00:34:07.167 --> 00:34:12.333
So I've taught a fair bit, but now mostly just focused on the harmonica.

00:34:12.773 --> 00:34:24.003
Yeah, I saw you at the recent Harping by the Sea in February in Brighton in the UK and I attended one of your workshops and yeah, I thought you had a really good approach to your teaching in the workshop.

00:34:24.023 --> 00:34:26.985
You're very inclusive and really, I think you got the best out of people.

00:34:27.025 --> 00:34:28.927
So that was a really nice workshop you did.

00:34:29.367 --> 00:34:30.007
Oh, thank you.

00:34:30.047 --> 00:34:31.650
That was the advanced one.

00:34:31.710 --> 00:34:34.331
I was a bit scared about that workshop.

00:34:34.351 --> 00:34:40.023
Because, you know, when they label the harmonica players advanced and I thought, well, probably...

00:34:40.641 --> 00:34:46.088
A lot of the people in here have, you know, it all depends how you judge what an advanced player is.

00:34:46.168 --> 00:34:47.690
Is it a technical thing?

00:34:47.769 --> 00:34:49.032
Is it something else?

00:34:49.092 --> 00:34:50.333
Is it down to experience?

00:34:50.413 --> 00:34:53.777
So, you know, it's kind of a crude category in some ways.

00:34:53.876 --> 00:35:01.106
But I recognize that a lot of people in a workshop will be more skilled than myself in playing the harmonica.

00:35:01.146 --> 00:35:14.581
But what I try and do with the workshop is really bring in other people's skills as well, because I feel part of teaching is not just to, you know, to conduct a masterclass, but it's actually, it's about skill sharing.

00:35:14.661 --> 00:35:20.447
So it's about a group of people coming together and seeing what skills they can offer each other.

00:35:20.487 --> 00:35:23.030
And actually that was a big part of London Harps.

00:35:23.429 --> 00:35:31.836
I always felt that the group, you know, it was a nice meetup where people could come together and talk because of course every player's got different things and skills to offer.

00:35:31.876 --> 00:35:39.625
So I always, I always like to try and incorporate different members of the group and to bring out part of their style in in the best way possible

00:35:39.985 --> 00:35:54.721
yeah i used to attend a a group meetup where i used to do some teaching myself uh in bracknell uh something we used to call harp jam and this was before the london harmonica's group and i met my really good friend phil lewy who went to the harmonica group you probably you probably met phil there

00:35:55.021 --> 00:36:04.251
yeah he was there in the early days so phil and uh another great player called joff watkins they were both instrumental in the in the group in the early days

00:36:04.672 --> 00:36:13.708
and so So what you do offer quite a lot on your Harmonica Barge teaching website is videos that people can purchase and learn from the videos that you've recorded.

00:36:13.809 --> 00:36:16.474
And on here, you cover quite a lot of different styles.

00:36:16.494 --> 00:36:18.577
So it'll be interesting to talk through some of those styles.

00:36:19.018 --> 00:36:21.021
So you mentioned earlier on the fox chase.

00:36:21.081 --> 00:36:22.905
So you've got a fox chase one.

00:36:22.945 --> 00:36:24.648
You're talking about how that's all about the groove.

00:36:40.097 --> 00:36:42.648
Maybe tell us a little bit about a fox chase.

00:36:43.251 --> 00:36:43.954
Yeah, sure.

00:36:43.994 --> 00:37:01.827
So what I'm really trying to do in the in-depth lessons, well, when I started the regular YouTube channel, I realised that I think what appeals about YouTube videos is they're short and concise, but I realized I had a lot more to offer in terms of techniques and then a systematic approach to learning a style.

00:37:01.867 --> 00:37:05.371
So that's where the in-depth lessons really started.

00:37:05.411 --> 00:37:35.793
Again, so with something like the Fox Chase, a lot of that is really working on the fundamentals of getting a super strong groove with a good And then building on top of that, again, in quite a systematic way, even though I love creativity in music, but I feel that I've always learned best from good teachers I've had when they've been quite systematic in the approach and the difficulty level rises quite slowly.

00:37:36.034 --> 00:37:38.195
That's always an important thing.

00:37:38.556 --> 00:37:48.605
So something like the Fox Chase, building that groove and having a selection of licks, two-bar licks, part of those will be inspired by other versions of the Fox Chase that I've heard.

00:37:48.644 --> 00:37:54.070
Some of them will just be made up out of scales, but they'll all try and be within that style.

00:37:54.110 --> 00:37:55.650
That's what I'm aiming for.

00:37:55.990 --> 00:38:01.516
And then you've got another video on Cajun harmonica, and there's actually an interview on you, which I'll put a link to.

00:38:01.556 --> 00:38:04.197
And you mentioned your father early on, he plays drums.

00:38:04.237 --> 00:38:08.186
I believe he was in one of the first Cajun bands in the UK?

00:38:08.706 --> 00:38:08.987
Yes.

00:38:09.128 --> 00:38:12.498
So the longest running Cajun band in the UK, I believe.

00:38:12.617 --> 00:38:15.525
So they were called Our Cajun and the Zydeco Brothers.

00:38:15.867 --> 00:38:19.878
So it's actually set up by an accordion player by the name of Chris Hall.

00:38:20.130 --> 00:38:23.014
who's featured with Paul McCartney on Jules Holland.

00:38:23.155 --> 00:38:26.119
And he sort of does all things Cajun in the UK.

00:38:26.320 --> 00:38:27.382
He's still got a few bands.

00:38:27.641 --> 00:38:28.643
So they were going for a while.

00:38:28.903 --> 00:38:32.208
Yeah, I certainly grew up listening to a lot of Cajun and Zydeco music.

00:38:32.289 --> 00:38:35.253
That's definitely been an influence in my harmonica playing.

00:38:35.273 --> 00:38:38.880
And I really love how Zydeco grooves sit on the harmonica.

00:38:38.960 --> 00:38:39.119
And...

00:38:56.577 --> 00:38:57.934
bluesy Zydeco grooves.

00:38:58.420 --> 00:38:59.675
I think they go really well.

00:38:59.938 --> 00:39:07.083
when you're mixing them with blues licks and chords and obviously the splits and that kind of rhythmic style I really love.

00:39:07.403 --> 00:39:09.065
And then you do some gospel.

00:39:09.106 --> 00:39:12.088
You do a I Shall Not Be Moved, some gospel harmonica.

00:39:12.108 --> 00:39:13.210
Oh, yeah.

00:39:13.269 --> 00:39:16.112
I mean, that's been a, excuse the pun, that's been a bit of a revelation.

00:39:16.351 --> 00:39:23.639
But I just came across this scene of gospel harmonica players and preachers who played harmonica.

00:39:23.858 --> 00:39:26.501
So one in particular, Elder Roma Wilson.

00:39:26.860 --> 00:39:29.222
Ain't

00:39:29.242 --> 00:39:29.563
it a shame?

00:39:29.583 --> 00:39:29.903
Ain't it a shame?

00:39:29.903 --> 00:39:40.717
I just

00:39:40.757 --> 00:39:46.184
came across his playing and it just felt really fresh and really different and really groovy.

00:39:46.264 --> 00:39:48.166
I hadn't heard anything like that.

00:39:48.307 --> 00:39:53.114
So part of the fun of teaching that was just being able to learn it myself.

00:39:53.505 --> 00:39:55.351
well, to the best of my abilities.

00:39:55.411 --> 00:40:01.927
And I think that's where it comes in with a lot of these players, like Peg Leg Sam is another one, these groovy, rhythmic harmonica players.

00:40:15.617 --> 00:40:22.045
I get to listen to that and try and pick out some of that, those ideas, and I'll be incorporating that into my own playing.

00:40:22.445 --> 00:40:24.807
And then I can try and build a nice lesson out of that.

00:40:25.309 --> 00:40:28.612
So yeah, the gospel, the gospel's really, that stuff's really cool.

00:40:28.652 --> 00:40:32.576
So yeah, Aldo Roma Wilson, the Rev Dan Smith is another one.

00:40:32.596 --> 00:40:38.001
I'm sure there's lots more that I haven't encountered, but yeah, it's some fantastic music.

00:40:38.402 --> 00:40:44.849
Yeah, I interviewed Todd Parrott, who's a current player in the US now, who plays a lot of gospel music, and it sounds fantastic on the harmonica.

00:40:45.153 --> 00:40:45.757
Oh, yeah.

00:40:45.836 --> 00:40:47.443
Yeah, I'm aware of him.

00:40:47.463 --> 00:40:48.588
He's a phenomenal player.

00:40:48.911 --> 00:40:51.623
Yeah, there's a big gospel scene there in the States.

00:40:51.963 --> 00:40:53.309
But this is quite...

00:40:53.409 --> 00:40:56.295
Quite a niche thing for the harmonica preachers.

00:40:56.434 --> 00:40:58.739
It was certainly something that I didn't know about.

00:40:58.998 --> 00:41:00.882
So yeah, it was quite exciting to discover.

00:41:01.322 --> 00:41:05.851
Yeah, it'd be great to get a preacher using a harmonica during one of your sermons.

00:41:05.951 --> 00:41:06.952
I'd love to see that.

00:41:09.998 --> 00:41:11.521
Come revive that in Britain.

00:41:11.800 --> 00:41:12.181
Yeah.

00:41:12.601 --> 00:41:17.010
Maybe you get more people into church over here if there's some good blues music.

00:41:17.313 --> 00:41:17.855
I don't know.

00:41:18.516 --> 00:41:18.998
Definitely.

00:41:19.460 --> 00:41:22.829
And then old-timey music is something else you've specialised in.

00:41:22.849 --> 00:41:24.273
You do a song called Cindy.

00:41:31.192 --> 00:41:31.934
MUSIC PLAYS

00:41:39.041 --> 00:41:43.865
So old-timey is kind of like it's melodic tunes-based approach, isn't it, to playing a harmonica?

00:41:44.306 --> 00:41:45.266
Yeah, absolutely.

00:41:45.347 --> 00:41:47.268
So the melodies and tunes are king.

00:41:47.548 --> 00:41:51.512
And I really got into that through going to those bluegrassy sessions.

00:41:51.572 --> 00:41:55.916
Obviously, the bluegrass and old-time are kind of similar in terms of their repertoire.

00:41:56.197 --> 00:41:59.159
So there was a lot of tunes played at the bluegrass sessions.

00:41:59.260 --> 00:42:06.666
And to join in, really, unless you're amazingly fast to pick things up by ear, it helps to really learn the tunes.

00:42:07.186 --> 00:42:09.007
I got into those kind of styles.

00:42:09.007 --> 00:42:17.163
It's very much a niche scene with old time, but actually a lot of old recordings, you know, again, sort of going back to 30s and 40s.

00:42:17.222 --> 00:42:20.228
There's some really great harmonica, people like Dr.

00:42:20.289 --> 00:42:22.291
Humphrey Bate and his Possum Hunters.

00:42:37.025 --> 00:42:38.186
They've all got great names.

00:42:38.606 --> 00:42:40.028
He was a banjo player.

00:42:40.349 --> 00:42:42.590
A lot of sort of tongue block playing in first position.

00:42:42.630 --> 00:42:45.934
And that was something that I was into quite heavily for a year or two.

00:42:46.014 --> 00:42:48.496
And I took some lessons with a great player.

00:42:48.675 --> 00:42:51.778
I believe he's in Arkansas now by the name of Seth Shoemate.

00:42:51.958 --> 00:42:53.179
I think you pronounce his last name.

00:42:53.320 --> 00:42:54.001
Sorry, Seth.

00:42:55.101 --> 00:42:56.762
He's a wonderful old time player.

00:42:56.782 --> 00:43:01.827
And I had some lessons with him and that was really, that was something radically new that I hadn't tried.

00:43:01.887 --> 00:43:06.170
And that's become a big influence on me, but I've sort of gone back to playing.

00:43:06.452 --> 00:43:23.389
I guess I'm more of a blues sort of second position player originally so i've tried to take a lot of those techniques melodic techniques and then blend them with more bluesy bluesy stuff and the kind of zydeco style as well rather you know i still dabble a little bit in first position oh yeah i really appreciate that style of playing

00:43:23.670 --> 00:43:35.663
yeah you've also got a country video so as you mentioned that you know you've covered various different styles on your teaching videos here is this more to introduce people to the different styles but you know you maybe you've gone back to playing more blue stuff yourself

00:43:35.943 --> 00:44:12.141
yeah that's definitely a strong element so i like i like exposing people to these these more unusual styles i mean that suits me and the the kind of music that i like listening to in terms of harmonica although i like a lot of varied music and i enjoy listening to modern harmonica players as well you know a lot of i've been recently exploring some of uh howard levy stuff after listening to your great interview and that's completely mind-blowing a lot of his folk stuff special odd time signatures so So I definitely have a lot of respect for those sort of more progressive modern players as well.

00:44:12.541 --> 00:44:26.197
But the old timey stuff, yeah, I like digging into those old recordings, using that as a vehicle for my own creativity and yeah, to teach that and share that wealth of music with other people.

00:44:26.297 --> 00:44:30.161
So hopefully it inspires them to create their own music out of it.

00:44:30.521 --> 00:44:32.123
Yeah, and I like those different styles.

00:44:32.182 --> 00:44:40.351
I do play some old time harmonica myself and I think it just gives you a bit of a different approach, doesn't it, to your home monica playing rather than they're just you know kind of forever playing blues licks and things

00:44:40.791 --> 00:45:24.378
absolutely and i think learning melodies is just a great thing to do regardless of the style you know even if you're really into blues and learning to play you know vocal melodies is something that i really like to do with blues to to go off it and and build on it even if you don't really know what's going on in the song so that's that's a big part of my approach the melodic style of playing and it gets you just playing different combinations of notes and you know i'm sure you found movements in a way like if you try and learn a bluegrass fiddle tune on the harmonica you're going to move on the instrument in a way that's unusual to you and that's always good to to expand your repertoire and change up your approach you know so i think that's that's just a great thing to do all around

00:45:24.759 --> 00:45:51.197
yep absolutely yeah great then so people can check out your harmonica barge teaching website i'm going to put a link on to that so moving on a little bit some of this session where you've done some session work over there in london there you've done a recording for a bb radio 4 program you've um recorded some other things you also i found you playing on a uh austin vince motorcyclist uh sort of video which you're playing some bluesy stuff on there

00:45:57.282 --> 00:45:57.782
Oh, right.

00:45:57.882 --> 00:46:00.425
Yeah, that was actually a year or two back.

00:46:00.485 --> 00:46:02.206
That was a really nice experience.

00:46:02.286 --> 00:46:07.990
Austin takes groups of motorbikers over to the Pyrenees and does these trips.

00:46:08.050 --> 00:46:10.793
So he's a bit of a filmmaker as well.

00:46:10.934 --> 00:46:12.114
So that was a promo video.

00:46:12.454 --> 00:46:13.635
That was a really nice session.

00:46:13.675 --> 00:46:19.181
We just went in with a bunch of musicians I'd never met before, put a few tracks down in a day.

00:46:19.201 --> 00:46:25.226
I think we got four tracks down and then a short sort of sound clip as well for the film.

00:46:25.246 --> 00:46:58.681
But he's very much into 60 production that was quite a part of that something which i've i've not really dabbled in that much but i was you know i was happy to go along with whatever he wanted so yeah that was a that was a really fun thing to do harmonica wise do you just play diatonics you play any chromatic or anything else well people keep giving me um students or you know someone's always got like their grandpa had this harmonica line around covered in dust and i politely accept them although now i've actually had to you know i've got a whole box of these things now so i'm trying not to take any more I do have a chromatic.

00:46:59.061 --> 00:47:03.025
Someone gave me a Super 64, actually, a lady who I worked for.

00:47:03.106 --> 00:47:04.768
And it was her dad's.

00:47:05.108 --> 00:47:08.992
He was touring around Austria in the 50s with a little harmonica group.

00:47:09.032 --> 00:47:09.793
So it'd be lovely.

00:47:10.054 --> 00:47:15.418
I do plan on one day maybe trying to learn a tune on it, but not enough hours in the day.

00:47:15.739 --> 00:47:16.820
But one day, hopefully.

00:47:17.621 --> 00:47:20.844
So the question I ask each time, Ed, is this 10-minute question.

00:47:20.864 --> 00:47:23.989
So if you had 10 minutes to practice, what would you spend those 10 minutes doing?

00:47:24.708 --> 00:47:25.730
Wow, that's a tricky one.

00:47:26.170 --> 00:47:44.731
I might be a contrarian actually i would say half of that don't practice just think about practicing sometimes just listening to music and even imagining what you would play over it especially if you don't have much time can make you really hungry for playing and then use the other five minutes to try and play what you'd imagine yourself playing whatever it is

00:47:45.411 --> 00:47:54.641
and what about any sort of practice routines you know specifically on harmonica have you followed any practice routines maybe earlier on when you were playing or now do you follow any practice routines

00:47:55.481 --> 00:48:30.699
yeah i mean my practice is quite a haphazard for harmonica to be honest I just play I play whenever I can as often as I can it tends to lean these days towards specific things that I'm working on songs that I'm writing and if some of those need obviously a little bit of technical adjustment or help so you know I've been for example there's a song on the new Rigmorolas album which is in first position it's got a lot of splits and blow bends so I've been working on tongue block blow bending to try and get some of those techniques so it's quite the practice is quite focused for a goal, whatever musical goal I've got.

00:48:31.179 --> 00:48:32.422
And then it runs in phases.

00:48:32.521 --> 00:48:44.394
So I've actually been inspired to play some 12th position recently after getting into a little bit of jazz, hearing some of those jazz melodies and realizing, wow, having a little bit of that on the harp would be quite nice.

00:48:44.494 --> 00:48:49.599
So I'd say that kind of playing is probably my weakness, that single note melodic playing.

00:48:49.679 --> 00:48:53.985
So yeah, it's always good to work on your weaknesses as well as your strengths.

00:48:54.304 --> 00:49:02.134
I'm never, ever short of things to be in inspired to practice, you know, there's always, there's always a thousand things that I feel I could work on.

00:49:02.755 --> 00:49:02.954
Yeah.

00:49:03.255 --> 00:49:04.617
Not enough time in the day, as you say.

00:49:04.657 --> 00:49:08.442
So we'll get on to you talking about the last section now and talking about gear.

00:49:08.501 --> 00:49:11.646
So first of all, what harmonica do you like to play?

00:49:11.686 --> 00:49:15.670
So I like the, any kind of Marine band style harp.

00:49:15.690 --> 00:49:24.702
I mean, I tried to cross over a few years back and I've never, I've never looked back since, but I've, Over the last few years, I've been trying to tweak my harps a little bit.

00:49:24.802 --> 00:49:27.344
Maybe I'll be rich enough to buy custom harps one day.

00:49:27.364 --> 00:49:27.965
I don't know.

00:49:29.987 --> 00:49:34.293
I've been trying to tweak my own and I've realized that having custom combs is quite nice.

00:49:34.333 --> 00:49:42.442
So mostly crossovers with an Andrew, I think you pronounce his last name, Zayats, the Canadian chap who makes the combs.

00:49:42.501 --> 00:49:46.045
And his videos have been a wealth of inspiration for working on harmonicas.

00:49:46.487 --> 00:49:49.130
Crossovers with one of his combs is my mainstay.

00:49:49.409 --> 00:50:03.161
Of course, you'll be making your own combs

00:50:03.501 --> 00:50:07.525
now.

00:50:19.376 --> 00:50:28.085
I mean, because I've got some harps that I've worked on and I've tweaked them quite nicely, I think you then want everything to be of that standard.

00:50:28.144 --> 00:50:31.989
So it's quite hard to go back and play something which doesn't respond very well.

00:50:32.030 --> 00:50:34.572
So I've been doing a lot of read profiling.

00:50:34.873 --> 00:50:35.773
It's a slow process.

00:50:35.813 --> 00:50:40.898
I don't know if you work on harps yourself, but I hope I'm getting better, but progress feels very slow.

00:50:41.519 --> 00:50:43.021
Yeah, I do some setup myself.

00:50:43.081 --> 00:50:46.344
And basically when I buy a new harmonica, I won't play it until I've set it up.

00:50:46.445 --> 00:50:48.887
So I pretty much do that every time I get a harmonica.

00:50:48.987 --> 00:50:49.327
So yeah.

00:50:49.327 --> 00:50:53.793
right yeah it's definitely worth it for me i mean you're seeing the benefits as well by the sounds of it

00:50:54.052 --> 00:51:22.322
yeah for sure and i think again it depends on the style you play so i think if you play a lot of splits then tuning is a thing because unless you don't mind the heart being out of tune but it's nice when the when the splits are well in tune so that's something to take a lot of time on i don't i don't really overblow with such a lot i've been dabbling a little bit recently but that that would be another thing you know having to set them up for that so i haven't i haven't reached that stage yet but yeah a lot a lot of read profiling for sure trying to make sure they're responsive

00:51:22.664 --> 00:51:34.856
well if you're going to take on the jazz you might have to get into the overblowing so yes yeah that goes um what about positions are you playing you know with the different styles you're playing specifically as well you you know you're learning using different positions for those

00:51:35.297 --> 00:52:35.340
yeah second is uh is my mainstay i dabble in first for rag rag timey stuff and old timey stuff that's that's really nice and a lot of jug bands as well it's like that high-end kind of first position playing also i really like really like fifth position and that's something that I've been managing to apply a lot of my sort of second position tongue block playing and adapt that for fifth and that's something that's really yeah I'm really really enjoying that I'm working on a lot of that stuff with students at the moment and I find in some ways you know we all kind of go for third position first for a minor minor style but actually fifth position in some ways is more intuitive if you're used to playing in second position because you've got that you know the relative minor if you play second position major kind of blue grassy style if you switch that round and playing fifth then you're into the relative minor and i find that's really useful for a lot of songs that that go to that you know switch between major and minor so yeah i'm really enjoying that at the moment and then dabbling as i say a little a little bit in 12th very occasionally in fourth

00:52:35.681 --> 00:52:42.528
yeah great no i think you're right about fifth position that's a really useful one and uh but what about um different tunings for harmonicas

00:52:42.969 --> 00:53:16.956
actually yeah i've occasionally buy altered tunings and i think i went to i went to a brendan power gig and i was inspired by his his playing so i have uh i have a power bender but i've been really enjoying some of the minor tunes harmonicas as well i've got a harmonic minor and i've been sort of working on this tune which is in seven four at the moment on it and i think that really kind of suits this minor style so But yeah, I like this harmonic minor's fun.

00:53:17.396 --> 00:53:20.838
And you've already mentioned that Will Greener was a tongue-blocking militant.

00:53:21.018 --> 00:53:23.782
Does that mean you're a dedicated tongue-blocker?

00:53:23.822 --> 00:53:26.744
I'm not a militant tongue-blocker.

00:53:26.864 --> 00:53:31.489
Although when I was learning with Will, I mean, he was so phenomenal tongue-block player.

00:53:31.789 --> 00:53:36.112
He had that massive tone and this deep kind of rhythmic style.

00:53:36.152 --> 00:53:39.135
He said, oh, that's the only way to play.

00:53:39.275 --> 00:53:41.077
So I didn't have any other teachers at the time.

00:53:41.137 --> 00:53:43.798
So for two years, I did nothing but tongue-block.

00:53:43.838 --> 00:53:47.902
And I think that's actually a really good thing sometimes to have that zero tolerance approach.

00:53:48.244 --> 00:53:56.713
And I'll say that to students because obviously there's a lot of people who sort of pucker and then they want to get into tongue blocking, but they find the bends more difficult and then they're constantly switching between the two.

00:53:56.992 --> 00:54:05.242
So I think having a period of doing nothing but tongue blocking to make yourself improve at the bends and those other techniques is a really good thing.

00:54:05.262 --> 00:54:10.047
So I do recommend that to students, but it all depends on style really.

00:54:10.106 --> 00:54:14.672
And I think as harmonica players, we often analyze things technically too much.

00:54:14.672 --> 00:54:22.190
and we don't really talk about style enough And I think, you know, if you're judging what kind of techniques, often people say, what should I do?

00:54:22.369 --> 00:54:23.411
Should I tongue block?

00:54:23.630 --> 00:54:27.494
And it's really like what I would say, what kind of harmonica do you like to hear?

00:54:27.534 --> 00:54:29.596
Who are the players you like to hear?

00:54:29.637 --> 00:54:33.900
And the best thing to do is emulate whatever techniques you like.

00:54:33.980 --> 00:54:35.221
You like to hear yourself.

00:54:35.340 --> 00:54:49.253
And if you let style lead you in that way, you know, if you really like Charlie McCoy and sort of fast, linear, single note playing, melodic playing, then you might want to play a lot of pucker and and really lean into that style.

00:54:49.594 --> 00:54:57.443
If you like a lot of the more sort of old timey kind of dirty notes, splits and octaves, then definitely leaning into the tongue blocking is a good thing.

00:54:57.742 --> 00:55:02.748
Because I got into bluegrass, you know, I often play melodies quite fast on higher harmonicas.

00:55:02.827 --> 00:55:07.512
And I sort of found that quite a lot of the tongue block nuance would sometimes be lost.

00:55:07.592 --> 00:55:11.577
So actually you want those kind of sharp, percussive bends that really cut through.

00:55:11.617 --> 00:55:19.786
And I don't consider myself to be great at that style, but I'll definitely use that now in that setting and And now I like to use both approaches.

00:55:20.266 --> 00:55:22.889
All depends whatever you want for the style, really.

00:55:23.349 --> 00:55:24.552
What about amplification?

00:55:24.811 --> 00:55:27.875
Well, I'm probably the sort of worst person for gear.

00:55:27.894 --> 00:55:31.398
I don't really class myself as much of a gear geek, but I do have an amp.

00:55:31.719 --> 00:55:38.206
Recently with the Rigmarollers, I sort of found that it's quite nice to have that handheld, more aggressive harp sound for a few tracks.

00:55:38.246 --> 00:55:42.990
But I've just been using a Fishman Mini Loudbox, which is like a 60 watt amp.

00:55:43.130 --> 00:55:45.012
And that does me for guitar.

00:55:45.074 --> 00:56:19.974
And I'll just take a line out of that if I'm playing a but that's okay for small small gigs so that's been fine i've got a blows me away sm58 which does the job fine as a mic i use a bulletini on a rack as well if i'm playing solo so that's slightly different but i also actually just i just bought a little valve amp because sometimes when i'm doing a solo gig it's quite helpful to have that extra amplification i can just use the fishman for the vocals i've got a little laney cob 10 not know much about valve amps that sounds pretty cool but i've yet to really road test it properly but we've We've got a whole bunch of summer gigs and festivals coming up.

00:56:20.233 --> 00:56:23.019
Sure, it'll get a good airing this summer.

00:56:23.661 --> 00:56:28.550
I sing into a regular vocal mic, and then I cut the 58 that blows me away, 58.

00:56:28.632 --> 00:56:33.461
I use a heartbreak pedal, so that gives me a little bit of grit.

00:56:33.793 --> 00:56:35.315
if I want that kind of sound.

00:56:35.576 --> 00:56:39.398
And I've recently, I've got an octave pedal as well, which is great fun.

00:56:39.418 --> 00:56:40.920
So I've been using that in a few songs.

00:56:41.260 --> 00:56:43.943
Actually, that one was inspired by Mad Cat.

00:56:44.302 --> 00:56:45.503
He uses that to great effect.

00:56:45.563 --> 00:56:52.530
And also from Wade Schumann from Hazmat Medina, I think is a wonderful creative player.

00:56:52.789 --> 00:56:53.851
And they're just a great band.

00:56:53.931 --> 00:56:57.373
So I was inspired by his use of the octave pedal as well.

00:56:57.393 --> 00:56:58.494
So I've been dabbling in that.

00:56:58.856 --> 00:57:01.197
Yeah, Hazmat Medina is a great player.

00:57:01.257 --> 00:57:03.360
They're touring Europe again this summer.

00:57:03.400 --> 00:57:06.282
So yeah, you and check them out but unfortunately not coming to the uk so uh

00:57:06.742 --> 00:57:14.552
yeah i locked on the tour list yeah what a shame i did wonder about trying to get over to europe maybe for one of the gigs but yeah i haven't investigated further

00:57:14.952 --> 00:57:19.155
yeah so you mentioned effects so do you use any other effects any reverb or anything like that delay

00:57:19.677 --> 00:57:34.197
well yeah i've actually got i've got a reverb pedal i've just got a boss um rv6 i think it's an rv6 rv5 one of those although the fisherman has reverb a bit of reverb on the amp which seems to be okay someone gave me a delay pedal as well so i'm yet yet to to try.

00:57:34.530 --> 00:57:35.050
try that.

00:57:35.231 --> 00:57:38.293
But yeah, there's a whole world out there of pedals I can see.

00:57:38.594 --> 00:57:39.173
Certainly is.

00:57:39.514 --> 00:57:41.815
I don't know if I'll ever have an enormous pedal board.

00:57:42.137 --> 00:57:47.721
I mean, it's a lot of stuff to remember to press with the feet when you're also playing drums with your feet.

00:57:47.780 --> 00:57:49.842
That's one of the problems I find with pedals.

00:57:50.103 --> 00:57:53.126
If I can just leave them on, then that's the ideal scenario.

00:57:53.485 --> 00:57:58.190
And then, so final question there, in your future plan, you mentioned that you've got a new album coming out with the Rigmarollers.

00:57:58.391 --> 00:58:00.012
When can we expect to hear that?

00:58:00.431 --> 00:58:02.434
So that'll be this year at some point.

00:58:02.574 --> 00:58:10.206
I better not say a date as we're still Recording is still well underway, but hopefully late summer, autumn would be nice.

00:58:10.447 --> 00:58:12.512
But yeah, we're really excited about that.

00:58:13.032 --> 00:58:14.775
And we're already gigging a lot of those songs.

00:58:14.896 --> 00:58:16.639
So yeah, it's all coming together nicely.

00:58:17.181 --> 00:58:19.505
So thanks so much for joining me today, Ed Hopwood.

00:58:19.985 --> 00:58:20.246
Thanks,

00:58:20.327 --> 00:58:20.606
Neil.

00:58:20.947 --> 00:58:21.889
Really nice to chat.

00:58:22.338 --> 00:58:25.041
Once again, thanks to Zydle for sponsoring the podcast.

00:58:25.322 --> 00:58:35.213
Be sure to check out their great range of harmonicas and products at www.zydle1847.com or on Facebook or Instagram at Zydle Harmonicas.

00:58:35.994 --> 00:58:41.001
Thanks to Ed for sharing his knowledge on different harmonica styles and for his tips on applying rhythm to our playing.

00:58:41.702 --> 00:58:42.923
And thanks again for listening.

00:58:42.963 --> 00:58:47.690
Remember to check out the Spotify playlist where many of the tracks from the episodes are available.

00:58:48.190 --> 00:58:50.614
Scroll to the end of the list for the latest editions.

00:58:51.329 --> 00:58:55.456
Ed has been kind enough to share an early cut from his upcoming Rigmorolas album.

00:58:56.317 --> 00:58:58.679
This great instrumental has a great title.

00:58:59.420 --> 00:59:00.882
Duck's Blood Breakdown.

00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:00.000
.

00:59:21.186 --> 00:59:26.494
That's fun! That's fun!